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help with selecting regulator for co2 airsoft vortex gun?

This area is for the discussion of BB or airsoft sub machine guns, and or other small arms such as pellets.
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help with selecting regulator for co2 airsoft vortex gun?

Unread postAuthor: enismirdal » Tue Jul 29, 2008 4:21 am

Yay, first post here and whatnot. Anyway, on to business. I've built a few spudguns, etc, and now I've decided to move to something a tad more fun - and usable in unofficial airsoft games.
I've already got plans for a prototype made up, I'm going to obtain and use a 5 lb CO2 tank, it'll be a half-hole inline vortex gun made primarily of SCH40 PVC with a few SCH80 parts.
Now, my big problem is that, after reading up on the various sorts of things recorded here and elsewhere and deciding what I want, I need to pick out a regulator. Based on the figures at NeoSpud.com for the UltimateInline Mark II, I figured that you need approximately 10-12 CFM at 130 PSI from the CO2 tank. My problem? I can't seem to find a regulator that's rated appropriately. Before I start calling welding supplies and paintball and scuba shops, I figured I'd ask if any of you have specific suggestions, things to avoid or have, etc. Any help would be much appreciated.
I am new here, and new to this sort of gun, so despite my research, I may well be wrong on any number of things. If I am, I would very much appreciate it if you'd correct me, or point me in the right direction to correct myself.
Oh, and at the moment I'm thinking I'll just grab myself some appropriately long airsoft barrel or some 6mm ID steel tubing from McMaster Carr. If anyone has better (or cheaper!) suggestions, please toss them my way.
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Unread postAuthor: jrrdw » Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:08 am

Post your plans, schetch's, pictures of what you have so far. Giving that information will aid in any help we can offer you in your quest.

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Unread postAuthor: enismirdal » Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:30 am

Thanks for the welcome. As of now, all plans, etc, are in paper format, and my scanner is in somewhat of a Schrodinger's Cat status. I have no drivers for it, and thus it either works, or it doesn't....and I don't know which just yet. I'll get them at some point here today though, if I can, and toss some pictures up. Until then, I can give a basic description. I'd do more, but I'm dead tired at the moment.
Essentially, I'm planning to use 2" PVC as the ammo reservoir and mount point for the plunger, and 1" PVC for the barrel shroud. It'll allow me, I figure, to have the barrel somewhat off-center and still make the gun look nice and symmetrical. I'm going to use endcaps and acrylic discs screwed and epoxied/sealed to the PVC as methods of stabilizing the barrel inside the shroud, as well as keeping the shroud from being pressurized. The barrel (and shroud) I plan on making roughly 12" long. This is somewhat of a best-guess on what will work well, though, I admit.
The 2" section will be split approximately in the middle, utilitizing the same sort of cam-lock quick-connect type fitting as in the UltimateInline Mark II (whose builder I would like to thank for that inspiration), and will use a pair of acrylic disks inside the rear-ward portion of 2" to stabilize the rod that the plunger will be attached to. That portion will also be endcapped at the rear to ensure a good seal. I figure I'll make that section about 18 inches, and split it a bit forward of the middle, giving me about an 8" pipe for the vortex block and ammo reservoir.
There will also be an internal bar-graph-type LED ammo gauge utilizing a magnetic strip attached to the plunger rod and 5 reed switches attached to the inner wall of the PVC, but that's already been designed.
I plan to use a pressure washer-type or blowgun-type handle for the air, piped as directly as possible into the proper location in the half-hole inline vortex block, connected to a flexible hose, running to a backpack-mounted 5 lb CO2 tank and attached regulator.
This being a prototype, it will absolutely not look pretty. If it functions at an eighth the expected fire rate and half or a quarter the expected FPS, I'll still be pretty happy. That said, I nonetheless plan to put my best efforts in and see how good i can make it.

Edit: Ah...sorry for the ridiculously long post. Maybe I'm not as tired as I thought...
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Unread postAuthor: Hotwired » Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:36 am

There will also be an internal bar-graph-type LED ammo gauge utilizing a magnetic strip attached to the plunger rod and 5 reed switches attached to the inner wall of the PVC, but that's already been designed.


Can't beat a clear chamber but there's nothing like having some bling on your cannon :D
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Unread postAuthor: enismirdal » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:06 am

Well...a clear chamber would work wonders, except for the fact that my friends and I play the vast majority of our games at midnight or later, with no lights on our playing field.
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Unread postAuthor: Carlman » Tue Jul 29, 2008 9:26 am

welcome to spudfiles and thankyou for not starting with a n00b post :D

I very much look forward to this gun mainly because of the led indicator!
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Unread postAuthor: Mr.Sandman » Tue Jul 29, 2008 11:08 am

as for you barrel one cheaper way is to go to a hobby store like hungates or hobby town because they have 6mm ID pipe for pretty cheap at 1 dollar a foot

and here is the regulater/air system that neospud uses
http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=p ... lpage=none
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Unread postAuthor: enismirdal » Tue Jul 29, 2008 2:25 pm

Thank you much! I definitely appreciate the tips on barrel and regulator. If that system handles the various BBMGs listed on neospud, it should certainly handle mine, and I don't see why that sort of barrel wouldn't work perfectly fine. I'll see what hobby stores are around here.
Also, Carlman, if you want any electrical diagrams, etc, for the LED indicator, I can post them later on today. Actual pictures of the project box may be a little more difficult but if anyone wants one, or a parts list, or whatnot, I'll get whatever info I can manage posted up here. Just be warned, I decided to be a bit silly with the LEDs, and the project box definitely shows the marks of being a first-ever prototype.
And, out of curiosity, what do you mean by a n00b post? One of those uninformed "help me I know nothing" posts? Thanks for saying I didn't make one though.
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Unread postAuthor: bugsingelyn » Wed Jul 30, 2008 10:08 am

You can find cheap CO2 regulators on ebay for beer taps. They have great flow, but are big. I filled a 4" x 24" chamber in less than 8 seconds. Paintball regs don't have nearly enough flow, and most will not be consistent below ~200 psi.

http://cgi.ebay.com/CO2-LOW-PRESSURE-REGULATOR-BEER-OR-SODA_W0QQitemZ120286906708QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item120286906708&_trksid=p3286.m14.l1318

That regulator only has an output guage (the low pressure side, not how much is in the CO2 tank), but you dont need to know how much pressure the CO2 tank has in it, it wont tell you how much you have to go until it's empty anyways. I have worked with this style reg before, so if you need help just PM me.

Also, I had a problem with the tank freezing up, but you shouldnt have a problem if you are in a warm area. It will not work in the winter though.

I hope this helped you out, and good luck! Sounds like a great project.
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Unread postAuthor: enismirdal » Wed Jul 30, 2008 1:23 pm

Thank you, it did indeed. I'll take a look about and see if I can find a ~120 PSI max (or more) variant of that sort of thing, assuming such a thing is available.
I'll get my drawings put up eventually, probably in another thread. My scanner is being a lot more stubborn than I'd hoped.
Also, my prototype LED ammo gauge - minus the sensors, just the basic electronics box - works perfectly, so good news there. I'll get a picture of that up soon too.
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Unread postAuthor: kablooie » Wed Jul 30, 2008 7:25 pm

Here's the regulator I have, it works very well, although the max psi I've ever gotten out of it was 120. It has two gauges, and is very easy to use.
http://www.beveragefactory.com/draftbee ... 42HP.shtml

p.s. I use it on a 10 pound CO2 tank.
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Unread postAuthor: enismirdal » Wed Jul 30, 2008 8:54 pm

Nice. That's almost exactly what I'm looking for. How's the output on that valve, kablooie? Good enough cfm for a BBMG, I assume?
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Unread postAuthor: DrowningTrout » Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:04 pm

I just bought that Kobalt CO2 System from lowes, about a week ago!

It works good (kinda, have problems with CO2 leaking around the threads, O-Rings replaced then does it again after a little while :()

Overal I like it! I Bought it for my airsoft mortar project!
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