Login    Register
User Information
Username:
Password:
We are a free and open
community, all are welcome.
Click here to Register
Sponsored
Who is online

In total there are 75 users online :: 4 registered, 0 hidden and 71 guests


Most users ever online was 155 on Mon Aug 15, 2016 1:40 am

Registered users: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], Google Adsense [Bot], Yahoo [Bot] based on users active over the past 5 minutes

The Team
Administrators
Global Moderators
global_moderators.png CS

Plunger Tee Vortex Magazine

This area is for the discussion of BB or airsoft sub machine guns, and or other small arms such as pellets.
Sponsored 
  • Author
    Message

Plunger Tee Vortex Magazine

Unread postAuthor: ISA_Yoshi » Sun Oct 12, 2008 7:52 pm

I've noticed a few people trying to design an easily replaceable magazine for their BBMG. I ask: Why can't you have the best of both worlds?

I realize there are some problems that will have to be worked around, but the basic idea should work. This is just a rough design.

- A pin holds the magazine into the gun.
- Two pins/screws/whatever hold the top of the plunger system so it doesn't go flying out of the magazine.
- A "tee" vortex block is positioned at the bottom of PVC pipe
- Air fitting is attached to each magazine. (I'd use a quick connect on each, and just plug in the air source directly to the mag)
- Instead of having the barrel coming directly out of the vortex, a tube comes out and goes through the bbs/plunger system.
- The tube is made to bee able to fit over whatever you're using as a barrel. The barrel should be able to be seen from the (magwell? - can't think of right word right now) The tube simply slips over the barrel.
- bbs will go through the tube just as if it were the barrel directly, and make their way to the barrel.
- There will be some blowby due to the larger diameter of the tube, but it should be minimal because the bbs will go through the smaller diameter barrel.

I don't have much time right now because of school, but as soon as the semester ends in December, I plan on trying this design out.
Until then, feedback/comments/possible improvements would be greatly appreciated.

I apologize for the crappy drawing. I spent about two minutes in paint doing it, and the late nights are starting to make my hand less steady. I just needed to get the design out of my head before I forgot it.

- ISA_Yoshi
  • 0

Attachments
side view.JPG
User avatar
ISA_Yoshi
Specialist
Specialist
 
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 8:44 pm
Location: PA, USA
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: VH_man » Sun Oct 12, 2008 9:59 pm

looks good.

In fact...... this might be what i do for my BBMG project.......
  • 0

User avatar
VH_man
Major General
Major General
 
Posts: 1827
Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 6:00 pm
Location: New Hampshire
Reputation: 1

Unread postAuthor: ISA_Yoshi » Sun Oct 12, 2008 11:17 pm

Glad I could help. I've read the post for the "MkII clip" and seen Davidvaini's (Is it David?) original idea, and now his new one involving an actual hi-cap. I just thought things could be better. The only problem is you have to make a vortex for every mag that you want.

Let me know how yours works out and any improvements you make. Hopefully I'll be able to have my own finished in between semesters.
  • 0

User avatar
ISA_Yoshi
Specialist
Specialist
 
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 8:44 pm
Location: PA, USA
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: SNDM » Mon Oct 13, 2008 4:20 am

why dont you put the air input the same end as the bb output, mor length for the bb to be accelerated, air has greater effect, less air consumption (more bb consumption however.)

This is instead of the air coming in from below.

Is there any reason for why this might not be practical?
Thankeye Greatlye
  • 0


SNDM
Sergeant
Sergeant
 
Posts: 84
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 4:05 pm
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: ISA_Yoshi » Mon Oct 13, 2008 10:05 am

SNDM:

Like I said, this was a quick sketch. Changes can be made to the design. Anyone who makes this can change whatever they want. I won't be able to actually produce this for a while. I was just putting the idea out there.

As for practicality: multiple vortex blocks (one in each magazine). It's more the pain of having to make a block for each than impractical.


Would the air input directly under the bb out tube be more air efficient? Higher ROF?

Image
  • 0

User avatar
ISA_Yoshi
Specialist
Specialist
 
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 8:44 pm
Location: PA, USA
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: Davidvaini » Mon Oct 13, 2008 1:11 pm

hi, My vortex Cap design allows magazines and you only need one vortex cap.. This just looks like its over complicating things to get the same effect.. replaceable magazines with a vortex system. I would suggest looking at the RC-P240 provided here:

http://www.spudfiles.com/forums/rc-p240 ... 12907.html

The vortex cap allows "easy to make replaceable magazines". The magazines simply snap down into the vortex cap. The vortex cap magazines are also portable because they have a pin that holds the bbs in untill you insert them into the gun...

So what does this design do that my vortex cap design doesnt?

I say keep trying to come up with some good new designs but really make sure to look ever the previous designs carefully first.

I have two BBMG designs, The vortex Cap, and the Direct Feed BBMG..
  • 0

Last edited by Davidvaini on Mon Oct 13, 2008 4:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Davidvaini
Major General
Major General
 
Posts: 1315
Joined: Tue May 29, 2007 8:58 pm
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: ISA_Yoshi » Mon Oct 13, 2008 3:36 pm

First of all, your RC-P240 was the first BBMG I had ever seen. Don't assume that people are idiots because of one harmless mistake.

Yes, I know this design is a little more complicated. I pointed that out as one of the problems.

I joined this site for help with designs and as a way to bounce ideas off of other people, not to be criticized over the smallest details. Just because you consider yourself a BBMG expert doesn't mean you know everything or have the right to criticize people without reading the original post. I asked for suggestions on improvement, not someone telling me that the idea's been seen before. I see it as you showing off, saying, "I had the idea first and it's better than yours"

You could have simply said something like:
Seems a lot like a vortex block, maybe that would be a better way to go.

I thought someone like you would be a little more sympathetic with people starting out. If you keep going like this, you might just ruin someone else's experience on the site.
  • 0

User avatar
ISA_Yoshi
Specialist
Specialist
 
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 8:44 pm
Location: PA, USA
Reputation: 0

Sponsored

Sponsor
 


Unread postAuthor: Davidvaini » Mon Oct 13, 2008 3:58 pm

I'm not assuming you are an idiot. I'm offering advice which is to look at other designs to help yours out.

You said, "I've noticed a few people trying to design an easily replaceable magazine for their BBMG. I ask: Why can't you have the best of both worlds? "

That lead me to beleive you havnt seen a BBMG design that has replaceable magazines. So I was just giving you advice to look at the vortex cap design which offers removable magazines.

I don't claim to be always right but I will always give my advice on designs. I am not gonna say it looks like a vortex block and be done with it. If I see something wrong with a design I am going to mention such problem.


I am not trying to ruin your expierence on this site. But this site is educational and I hope you take peoples advice and criticisms about your designs. There are problems with all of my designs and I always try to take peoples advice on how to fix said problems.

Since you are new, and you made it sound like why cant we have replaceable magazines with a vortex system, it made me believe you didnt see my design (vortex cap). You did mention on how you seen my design with the highcap airsoft magazine but thats a completely different design.

So I stick with my original suggestion which is always try to learn as much as you can before posting a design and always be open to criticism and suggestions of your designs.

I hope I didnt ruin your expierence on this site but If the design has been done before and the previous design was more simple I'm going to point out there are easier ways to do the same thing whether its my design or not.

I wasnt trying to attack you, I'm sorry if you felt that way, I can understand how you could feel attacked if you think you have understood a design and you are told otherwise. furthermore, I would appreciate it if you didnt attack me and my skill level. I think I have gave this site more than enough and I think I have proven myself enough. I will continue to help people in their endeavors even if that means letting them know they are wrong.

Have a nice day.
  • 0

User avatar
Davidvaini
Major General
Major General
 
Posts: 1315
Joined: Tue May 29, 2007 8:58 pm
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: ISA_Yoshi » Mon Oct 13, 2008 5:14 pm

Looking back, I probably went a little too far. I had just gotten out of a not-so-great Calc class and was looking for some good news. That post just rubbed me the wrong way. I'm sorry for snapping at you.

I realize your vortex cap is more efficient. That doesn't mean it's always going to be the best option though. I've read at least three posts about other alternatives for a removable BBMG magazine, including yours which had the look of an actual magazine (can't find the post right now)

Like I said in the first post, I had a kind of epiphany and had to get the idea down. There are always going to be more efficient and "better" ways to accomplish ideas. I just felt the criticism of
keep trying to come up with some good new designs but really make sure to look ever the previous designs carefully first
was a slap in the face. I specifically said that I had seen the other designs?

As for
Why can't you have the best of both worlds?
I was just being a little dramatic with the post.

BTW, I've always wondered: how do you keep the spring-loaded magazines for the RC-P240 contained before loading them into the vortex cap? Subsequently, how do you release the bbs to allow them to feed?

As I said, your RC-P240 was the first BBMG I had ever seen. At first I couldn't wrap my mind around 115 bb/s. It made me want to learn more about BBMGs and how they work. Thank you.
  • 0

User avatar
ISA_Yoshi
Specialist
Specialist
 
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 8:44 pm
Location: PA, USA
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: brogdenlaxmiddie » Mon Oct 13, 2008 5:28 pm

I'm sorry, but Vaini is completely correct in this issue. His design is basically a better version of what your saying. I'm not saying your idea is wrong or dumb, just over complicated. Also, Why all the hostility?? :?

Edit- Sorry, I was a bit late in posting. I went down for dinner before you posted the above comment. I then came back and clicked Submit. Sorry about that. :oops:
  • 0


brogdenlaxmiddie
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 562
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2007 2:19 pm
Country: United States (us)
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: Davidvaini » Mon Oct 13, 2008 7:52 pm

oh its really simple.. it has a pin that holds the bbs into the magazine.. you simply load the magazine in and pull the tab and it releases the bbs into the vortex cap.

here is a picture:

Image

Image

The pin is located around the end of the magazine.
  • 0

User avatar
Davidvaini
Major General
Major General
 
Posts: 1315
Joined: Tue May 29, 2007 8:58 pm
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: ISA_Yoshi » Mon Oct 13, 2008 8:09 pm

So the bbs exit the mag through just a slit, not the entire area of the pipe? interesting.

Also, with the high ROF, have you ever thought to simply extend the pipe that is the magazine? It looks like there are still a couple of inches you have to work with. Might be able to squeeze another 50-100 rounds in. Hey, every shot counts in a firefight. You might have to change the name though. Or for example you could just say it's an RC-P240 that can use the RC-P340 magazine, lol.
  • 0

User avatar
ISA_Yoshi
Specialist
Specialist
 
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 8:44 pm
Location: PA, USA
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: SEAKING9006 » Mon Oct 13, 2008 8:46 pm

I just noticed another (humorous) reason you need to do a little more research on vortex BBMGs....

Every shot counts in a firefight


There's no way in hell you're getting single shots out of one of these! :lol: :lol:

JK, that one just seemed funny to me when were talking about guns that are never fired for less than two seconds at a time, expelling no fewer than 150 projectiles per second..... :wink:
  • 0

Completed projects:
CA1 SMSS Basic Inline
CA3 PDAB Airburst Cannon

Current Project: Bolt action rifle (25x140mm + 1in shot)

SEAKING9006
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 734
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2008 3:20 pm
Location: Texas
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: ISA_Yoshi » Mon Oct 13, 2008 9:07 pm

haha, yeah. I know there's no way to get a single shot out of a normal BBMG. That's what I like about 'em.

But wouldn't you rather have a larger capacity magazine if you knew you could empty it in a matter of a few seconds? Every round you have in your mag/reserve...whatever, is another round that will eventually come out of the barrel at your target.

Higher capacity => more rounds fired => more chances to hit your target before you get hit.[/u]
  • 0

User avatar
ISA_Yoshi
Specialist
Specialist
 
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2008 8:44 pm
Location: PA, USA
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: SEAKING9006 » Mon Oct 13, 2008 9:24 pm

That's the beauty of a vortex gun emplacement ala Company of Heroes. :)

If you get engineers to set up a heavy vortex gun in a dug in nest fast enough, they will NEVER get past it's field of fire!

Unless of course they happen to steal the CA3 and start lobbing air burst shells over it. :lol:
  • 0

Completed projects:
CA1 SMSS Basic Inline
CA3 PDAB Airburst Cannon

Current Project: Bolt action rifle (25x140mm + 1in shot)

SEAKING9006
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 734
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2008 3:20 pm
Location: Texas
Reputation: 0

Next

Return to BB/Airsoft/Pellet Gun Discussion

Who is online

Registered users: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], Google Adsense [Bot], Yahoo [Bot]

Reputation System ©'