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Qwerty's Micro Hybrid

Built a hybrid cannon? Then post it here! This section is for completed, finished cannons that you have built. Please include pictures and information.
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Qwerty's Micro Hybrid

Unread postAuthor: qwerty » Mon May 02, 2011 12:33 pm

Anyway, after some thinking, i decided to make a hybrid. My first. I wanted more power but due to some leaks and that my syringe numbers have rubbed off i'm not too impressed.
I've tested it up to 5X and it's loud but the damage isn't too impressive. Again due to leaks and my syringe.
I have a feeling that some air is leaking through the wires and my shock pump's check valve is messed up causing it to leak slightly.

Specs:
Chamber: 15mm copper x 10.8cm
Barrel: 8mm OD 6mm ID of aluminium. No idea of the length, probably about 15 inches.
Burst disks: Sheets of packaging plastic.

That's about it.

The whole gun with the piezeo attatched:
Image

Close-up of the chamber:
Image

Looking down the barrel which is a 1/2 to 1/4 inch bushing with the barrel glued it.
Image

The rubber washer in the 1/2-15mm female straight:
Image

Damage, Top one is a .25g BB and the bottom one is a .22 Bisley practice pellet with the skirt widened.
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Unread postAuthor: wyz2285 » Mon May 02, 2011 12:41 pm

Nice :) But I wouldn´t call it micro, as jsr´s mini hybrid it´s much smaller without suppressor :wink:
first post :D
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Unread postAuthor: Doctore » Mon May 02, 2011 1:26 pm

You should call it:Qwerty's Pico Hybrid :D
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Mon May 02, 2011 2:36 pm

Congratulations on making it work! Welcome to the hybrid club ;)

I understand your feeling about power, I had exactly the same reaction at 6x. At this stage, performance will be similar to a HPA piston valve launcher.

You need to go higher for impressive performance.

What pressure do your disks burst at? and do they leave a clean 6mm hole?
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Unread postAuthor: DYI » Mon May 02, 2011 2:45 pm

I'm curious as to how the ignition electrodes are secured into the chamber. Did you just stick them in through a gob of epoxy? :lol:

Unfortunately, you're not going to get "impressive" performance out of a 6mm bore launcher made of plumbing parts. This is the reason that most launchers here are typically much larger bore than firearms. Hybrids are well suited to generating very high pressures and hot gases. When they're not used for this purpose, they're hardly worth the trouble.
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Unread postAuthor: qwerty » Mon May 02, 2011 3:04 pm

What pressure do your disks burst at? and do they leave a clean 6mm hole?


Well one layer bursts at about 50psi but i'm not sure if it double with another layer, i doubt it. Well they leave a 6mm hole but the bit that it punched out stays on.

I'm curious as to how the ignition electrodes are secured into the chamber. Did you just stick them in through a gob of epoxy? Laughing


Indeed, i did :)

Anyway, it's still quite good fun but i'm scared of going to higher mixes as it's only copper.
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Mon May 02, 2011 3:53 pm

DYI wrote:Unfortunately, you're not going to get "impressive" performance out of a 6mm bore launcher made of plumbing parts. This is the reason that most launchers here are typically much larger bore than firearms. Hybrids are well suited to generating very high pressures and hot gases. When they're not used for this purpose, they're hardly worth the trouble.


For those without access to firearms and acres of shooting range, small bore hybrids are actually a very good option. Indeed, they generate the sort of pressures which smaller calibres need for worthwhile performance.

Well one layer bursts at about 50psi but i'm not sure if it double with another layer, i doubt it.


How many layers are you using though? I would use at least 5 or 6.
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Unread postAuthor: Zeus » Mon May 02, 2011 4:52 pm

Try doing a rough model of it in HGDT, in fact I've just done that.

With a 0.25 gram bb, a 100psi burst disc gives 20J and a muzzle velocity of 404 m/s.

500 psi burst disc, 21J, 409 m/s.

Not really the point I wanted to make, oh well. Just have a play.

If you want it to be stronger, suspend it in a 1 inch pvc tube with the burst disc holder just above the top of the pipe. Then apply epoxy liberally, to excess really.[/list]
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Unread postAuthor: mobile chernobyl » Mon May 02, 2011 7:35 pm

jackssmirkingrevenge wrote:For those too weak to hold a firearm and have puny little shooting ranges, Weakling small bore hybrids are actually a very good option, if you like being a girly man. Indeed, they generate the sort of pressures which smaller calibres need for worthwhile performance like shooting through a wall made of air.


I schwarzeneggerfied it for you :wink:
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Tue May 03, 2011 12:07 am

Zeus wrote:If you want it to be stronger, suspend it in a 1 inch pvc tube with the burst disc holder just above the top of the pipe. Then apply epoxy liberally, to excess really.[/list]


Sound advice, encase it in slightly larger tubing and pour some epoxy :) it will solve your leaky ignitor issues too. Also putting less feet in your photos.

mobile chernobyl wrote:I schwarzeneggerfied it for you


:D :D :D

like shooting through a wall made of air.


If you make the air wall thick enough it will stop an ICBM :P
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Unread postAuthor: qwerty » Thu May 05, 2011 3:49 pm

Did another 5XI shot today at a deodorant can....... Bad idea.
I got sprayed with deodorant all over my face and my eyes still sting. Silly me... :roll:

I might make a high mix V2 out of steel threaded fittings and mount it like a miniature cannon. I have RC car shocks for recoil absorbers and a bit of wood, should be fun.
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Unread postAuthor: DYI » Thu May 05, 2011 6:25 pm

Indeed, they generate the sort of pressures which smaller calibres need for worthwhile performance.


Yes, they can. But not, as I remarked, when they're constructed from standard plumbing fittings. I was trying to design a hybrid recently to launch saboted 3/8" ball bearings at speeds from 500m/s to 1000m/s. Sounds simple enough, right? It is, but I was trying to do this with SCH40 pipe and hardware store fittings. Ended up with a reinforced type L copper barrel 3m long and a stupidly large chamber operating so close to its failure pressure as to require complete confinement in a heavy steel containment vessel.

Things obviously get better when ones starts using SCH80 or 160 pipe and #3000 or #6000 forged steel fittings, but those aren't standard plumbing pipes and fittings. The point is that, while "worthwhile" performance is, debatably, achievable in small bore launchers using only standard plumbing pipes and fittings, it's hardly a practical option.
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Unread postAuthor: mark.f » Thu May 05, 2011 9:21 pm

DYI wrote:The point is that, while "worthwhile" performance is, debatably, achievable in small bore launchers using only standard plumbing pipes and fittings, it's hardly a practical option.


Quoted for truth. I beat my Gen. II hybrid in muzzle energy with a pneumatic. Incidentally, it was made with SCH-80 seamless and #3000 fittings, but I limited myself to 5x anyway. What can I say? It was 2007.
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Fri May 06, 2011 6:12 am

DYI wrote:The point is that, while "worthwhile" performance is, debatably, achievable in small bore launchers using only standard plumbing pipes and fittings, it's hardly a practical option.


And who says you have to limit yourself to standard parts and fittings?

This one was literally put together from scrap with only basic tools for probably less than $50 of material and is (was ;D) quite a powerhouse for the urban limitations I have. Granted, it blew its barrel at 12x but that was due to a design flaw which could easily have been avoided.
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Unread postAuthor: spoeft » Fri Jul 08, 2011 7:38 am

how do you fuel with the syringe ? through the schrader valve with a connector of some sort , ? because the pressure rises in the chamber when fueling ... :p
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