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mini hybrid win!

Post questions and info about hybrid (compressed gas with fuel) powered cannons here. This includes discussion about fuels, ratios, ignition systems, build types, safety, and anything else relevant.
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Unread postAuthor: dewey-1 » Fri Jan 28, 2011 8:36 am

Still waiting for someone in the American mid-west to adopt me :roll:

Why would we do that when we already have enough crazy a$$ people like you! :D

You would be welcomed to the USA. Just make it to EAA in Oshkosh and I will welcome you.
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:31 am

dewey-1 wrote:we already have enough crazy a$$ people like you! :D


Exactly, who's going to notice one more ;)

You would be welcomed to the USA. Just make it to EAA in Oshkosh and I will welcome you.


That would be amazing, however plans for me to move in to an actual epoxy batcave are going to prove quite a drain on my finances in the foreseeable future, which means "frivolous" travelling will be out :cry:
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Unread postAuthor: the unit » Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:41 am

jackssmirkingrevenge wrote:Still waiting for someone in the American mid-west to adopt me :roll:


come out to canada, i got 85acres of field and bush waiting for yah :P
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Unread postAuthor: DYI » Fri Jan 28, 2011 3:58 pm

Still waiting for someone in the American mid-west to adopt me :roll:


Well, there is an available room 8 months per year now that I'm at uni...
Not the American Midwest, but how does countless square kilometres of isolated, unused land area sound? :lol:

Also, by running at 28X, I believe you're now in the top five for highest attempted hybrid mix. I have to ask though: Why so small? If this is not one of your typical valve, loader, or semi/full auto projects, why not use something like a 50cc chamber? Even unsilenced, they're not particularly noisy for indoor firing unless one happens to be using an under-proportioned barrel.
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Fri Jan 28, 2011 4:22 pm

Canada should be an obvious choice, technically I have dual citizenship ;)

Also, by running at 28X, I believe you're now in the top five for highest attempted hybrid mix.


Go me! Who would have thought :)

I have to ask though: Why so small? If this is not one of your typical valve, loader, or semi/full auto projects, why not use something like a 50cc chamber? Even unsilenced, they're not particularly noisy for indoor firing unless one happens to be using an under-proportioned barrel.


This one has a 90cc chamber, and 9x was quite on the limit I could tolerate in terms of power for indoor testing. The one time I took it to 12x blew the barrel out of the suppressor, I could repair it but even so I don't think would take it higher.

This one has a more reasonable 30cc chamber and I want to take it higher than the 12x maximum I've fired it so far, tomorrow morning perhaps :)

Still, the benefit of 28x would really be felt in a smaller calibre, so there's defintiely a 0.22"/6mm high mix project on the horizon :)
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Unread postAuthor: POLAND_SPUD » Fri Jan 28, 2011 4:56 pm

I have to ask though: Why so small?
lol it's his holy grail for god sake... small volume high mix hybid is the only way to build a gun that looks and operates pretty much in as a real one (and has respectable performance)

Not yet an epic win... but definitely it's a WIN
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Sat Jan 29, 2011 12:43 am

POLAND_SPUD wrote:small volume high mix hybid is the only way to build a gun that looks and operates pretty much in as a real one (and has respectable performance)


Like the man says :)

Not yet an epic win... but definitely it's a WIN


If anything, the fact that there were probably a couple of thousand psi in there and it didn't explode is already enough, go epoxy! woo!

edit: took the 0.75" hybrid to 20x fired at 1mm steel plate over a 0.6mm power supply case, it didn't penetrate fully but still, impressive damage.

Too bloody loud though, there's enough propane/butane in the chamber to fuel a 500cc combustion :roll: not going to fire it any higher unless I make a barrel extenstion with a suppressor.
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Sat Jan 29, 2011 4:46 am

Lovely sunshine so it seemed a shame not to shoot it again :)

Here's an old Sagem cellphone donated years ago for target shooting purposes, finally being put to good use, 20x and 1000 frames per second ;)

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KI5npC80AS4&feature=feedu[/youtube]

Target is the 3mm (just under 1/8") alloy heat sink from the CRT monitor board that gave up the flyback ignition (does that count as self harm :D), fired at with an unmodified CO<sub>2</sub> capsule at 20x.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okqOMMd7niU[/youtube]

The projectile went through the heat sink but was stopped by the heatsink behind it, some photos showing entry and exit holes as well as heat sink thickness:
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Unread postAuthor: POLAND_SPUD » Sun Jan 30, 2011 9:41 pm

have you considered 'swagging' your cartridges ??

lead is pliable and ductile, right ?
well if you build a cartridge with a sort of lip/recess, let say 0.5 cm from the front, you might be able to force a lead ball into the cartridge and achieve a perfect seal

Damn you might even build a special press for it (and include an automated metering system that first fuels the chamber then inserts ammo and seals the cartridge)
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Mon Jan 31, 2011 12:32 am

POLAND_SPUD wrote:have you considered 'swaging' your cartridges?


You know, you might just be on to something.

well if you build a cartridge with a sort of lip/recess, let say 0.5 cm from the front, you might be able to force a lead ball into the cartridge and achieve a perfect seal


That sort of construction is a bit involved for someone latheless, I'm thinking more along the lines of taking say a 5.5mm pellet and using it in a 5.0mm barrel. I'll have to built a test rig however to determine what pressure they will effectively hold (because now I've gone 28x, anything less seems rather homosexual :roll:) and if it will indeed be a perfect seal.

Damn you might even build a special press for it (and include an automated metering system that first fuels the chamber then inserts ammo and seals the cartridge)


Sounds slightly ambitious, but I can see myself making something like this. Open cap, insert projectile and cartridge, close cap, insert fuel through schrader valve and pressurise, then turn swaging screw to seal the projectile in the mouth of the cartridge.

edit: modified diagram for clarity
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Unread postAuthor: POLAND_SPUD » Mon Jan 31, 2011 1:28 am

cartridgefillerswager.GIF

google 'reloading arbor press'
Image

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if_Xt8SH0bc[/youtube]
insert fuel through schrader valve

Well, who said you need a shrader ?
:wink:

Yeah, I know it seems simpler to have shraders.
Though if you ever build an automated metering system for it you might as well get rid of shraders (well at least that would simplify cartridge design) and fuel through the same hole where the bullet is forced.

Yeah I know I know sounds horribly difficult to build but if you are to achieve world domination you're gonna need a lot of cartridges
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Mon Jan 31, 2011 2:44 am

POLAND_SPUD wrote:Well, who said you need a schrader?


The schrader is part of the filling system, I modified the diagram so it will be clearer. Air and fuel are charged through the schrader and enter the cartridge through the mouth.

Yeah I know I know sounds horribly difficult to build but if you are to achieve world domination you're gonna need a lot of cartridges


Given the disappointing micro hybrid test at 28x, I doubt that the kind of performance needed for world domination is achievable with a rifle sized cartridge :s
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Unread postAuthor: POLAND_SPUD » Mon Jan 31, 2011 10:13 am

The schrader is part of the filling system, I modified the diagram so it will be clearer. Air and fuel are charged through the schrader and enter the cartridge through the mouth.
Technically speaking you need manometric metering system* and two valves... two cams somewhere on the press and you've got a system that opens and closes the valves when needed so you just have to insert the cartridge and operate the lever


with a rifle sized cartridge
well it depends what you understand by the term rifle sized cartridge
if you mean .223 Remington then yeah... but what about .475 Nitro Express or .505 Gibbs ? :wink:



*I've been thinking about this distinction into manometric and volumetric metering and one being better than the other... well, if you think of it... volumetric meters are manometric too :D
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Mon Jan 31, 2011 1:23 pm

POLAND_SPUD wrote:two valves... two cams somewhere on the press and you've got a system that opens and closes the valves when needed so you just have to insert the cartridge and operate the lever


I can see it being made to work with one stroke, but unless you've made a hybrid minigun that fires at 100 rounds per second, it hardly seems worth the effort.

if you mean .223 Remington then yeah... but what about .475 Nitro Express or .505 Gibbs ? :wink:


Tonight, Pinky... :D

Anyway, crude prototype currently curing looking something like the diagram below and about the same size as the micro hybrid chamber. The plan is to see if it can retain pressure at all, if so to what extent, and then chose a close hybrid mix and go from there :)
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Unread postAuthor: Brian the brain » Mon Jan 31, 2011 5:06 pm

well it depends what you understand by the term rifle sized cartridge



Naval cannons are rifled... :D


And why go for world domination...
You might concider just taking over an unstable African country...

untill they overthrow you again.... :wink:
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Oh my friggin god stop being so awesome, that thing is pure kick ass. Most innovative and creative pneumatic that the files have ever come by!

Can't ask for a better compliment!!
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