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mini hybrid win!

Post questions and info about hybrid (compressed gas with fuel) powered cannons here. This includes discussion about fuels, ratios, ignition systems, build types, safety, and anything else relevant.
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Unread postAuthor: Gun Freak » Sat Apr 23, 2011 5:03 pm

I think his portable vortex counts too :P
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Sat Apr 23, 2011 11:55 pm

... and my penguns :P

The basic idea is to have a "universal" pistol grip and ignitor setup that you can attach to the chamber via the schrader thread, with the ignitor accessible because piezos tend to wear out eventially.
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Unread postAuthor: JDP12 » Sun Apr 24, 2011 1:16 am

Hmm... interesting. I like the idea of being able to swap out different launcher designs... I can't wait to get home and back to building again.
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Sun Apr 24, 2011 1:22 am

I think the key is to make things modular. I don't see the point of putting the effort into finishing a launcher that might screw up internally and cannot be repaired.
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hectmarr wrote:You have to make many weapons, because this field is long and short life
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Unread postAuthor: JDP12 » Sun Apr 24, 2011 1:31 am

Exactly. Modularity (is that even a word) is extremely useful in developing a testbed actual gun.. but still easy to prototype something.

I actually wanna bounce an idea off of you-- I've been thinking. if you put two thick rubber washers into the union- you may be able to make an almost bolt action out of it. If you add a handle to the lug, then you can just turn it possibly a quarter-half turn, and then possibly move it forward so the handle locks in place. That way, it makes the gun more "gun-like", and saves a bit of hassle of threading a union.

What do you think?
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Mon May 02, 2011 11:56 pm

JDP12 wrote:I actually wanna bounce an idea off of you-- I've been thinking. if you put two thick rubber washers into the union- you may be able to make an almost bolt action out of it. If you add a handle to the lug, then you can just turn it possibly a quarter-half turn, and then possibly move it forward so the handle locks in place. That way, it makes the gun more "gun-like", and saves a bit of hassle of threading a union.


... a sort of "bolt action cam-lock"? It could work, provided the handle was long enough to provide enough leverage for a tight lock. Hmmm...
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Unread postAuthor: JDP12 » Tue May 03, 2011 1:29 pm

Exactly.. that's pretty much what I had in mind. i don't see why it wouldn't work- yea you'd have to be able to get some leverage, but it would make the action of reloading a bit more like a gun, and easier in that you don't have to thread the union all the way.

If you could get it to only need a quarter or a half turn, it could easily be similar to many bolt actions out there today.

This comes to mind- http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009 ... mg-pistol/
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Tue May 03, 2011 3:06 pm

the mention demands this video :D

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8YGfC6955s[/youtube]
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hectmarr wrote:You have to make many weapons, because this field is long and short life
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Unread postAuthor: JDP12 » Tue May 03, 2011 3:17 pm

Bahahah thats awesome.. WHy are they dressed like that? For comedic effect?

but on a related note- do you think the idea is plausible?
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Tue May 03, 2011 3:46 pm

JDP12 wrote:Bahahah thats awesome.. WHy are they dressed like that? For comedic effect?


Yes, it's a segment from a longer clip

but on a related note- do you think the idea is plausible?


Yes - cam-locks work, and this is simply the same idea with different geometry.
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Sat Dec 03, 2011 5:19 am

Following a recent donation of a defunct toaster, herewith some fun with the mini 0.75" hybrid :D

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFuGm9U1F4A[/youtube]
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hectmarr wrote:You have to make many weapons, because this field is long and short life
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Unread postAuthor: pneumaticcannons » Sat Dec 03, 2011 6:57 am

You could possibly add a second lever to both minimize the stress on the single lever but mainly provide an equally tight grip on each side of the bolt/camlock mechanism.
The second lever wouldn't even have to stick out
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Re:

Unread postAuthor: hectmarr » Sat Sep 15, 2018 6:39 pm

jackssmirkingrevenge wrote:Update on the suppressor, the epoxy cured quicker than I expected so I've been doing some testing.

It's not exactly "mouse fart" effective, but it certainly takes the edge off the muzzle crack and the noise is a lot more tolerable. I did some chrony tests at various mixes too, first a video of a shot at 10x to show chrony reading and some indication of noise, target was a folded up towel so there should be little projectile impact noise.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKvmC4BuO6Y[/youtube]

Here's some data for 16 grain 0.22" pellets showing mix - velocity - muzzle energy:

8x - 840 fps - 25.1 ft/lbs

9x - 879 fps - 27.4 ft/lbs

10x - 925 fps - 30.4 ft/lbs

12x - 983 fps - 34.3 ft/lbs

14x - 991 fps - 34.8 ft/lbs

Yes, I got first click ignition at 14x :) I have to say that I wasn't expecting successful piezo ignition at such high mixes after CpTn_lAw's 8x limit data, but it works :D

The relatively small gain in velocity between 12x and 14x suggests that a stronger disk is needed to see more benefit. Two disks held at 10x but will probably fail at 14x, we'll see...

edit: Yes, 14x will burst a double disk :D I'll try and get a chrony reading.

Here's the (roughly sanded) suppressor, chamber and ignitor setup:

WOW WOW WOW WOW WOW! :bounce:
Excellent experimental information. It helps me a lot to have a real reference in my designs. :D
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Re: Re:

Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Sun Sep 16, 2018 4:28 am

hectmarr wrote:Excellent experimental information. It helps me a lot to have a real reference in my designs. :D


Hopefully you will soon be generating your own experimental data :)
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Re: mini hybrid win!

Unread postAuthor: hectmarr » Sun Sep 16, 2018 9:53 am

Yes, I can make my measurements :D However, the tests you performed give a frame of reference regarding the volume of the combustion chamber, in relation to caliber .22, .177, barrel length, mix pressure, ammunition speeds and damage in the objective, apart from the possibilities and problems of the piezoelectric ignition for these conditions, which is what I am using. As I said earlier, a practical basis to design from there.
It would be very good to gather these data in a single image, because they are scattered throughout the post and it is quite long. But also, with a little time, you can extract the info from the numbers and comments. always I have understood that science, (of the spud or in the field that is), NOT born with oneself, that's why you have to investigate what has already been done and learn it.
For example, I, based on this work, I have planned to reduce the volume of my combustion chamber to 20ml, (I am currently using about 30 ml). The result is that more pumping cycles are added unnecessarily, :oops: to compress my mix. Aside, raise the compression of the mix to at least 10 or 12x, which is where "music begins" for this type of mini hybrid, so I could read here. It may be necessary, to make more accurate all this information, the percentage of gas used in the mixtures. I am using a slightly rich mixture, based on the experimental results of jimmy101. Of course, the fundamental is complete. :)
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