Login    Register
User Information
Username:
Password:
We are a free and open
community, all are welcome.
Click here to Register
Sponsored
Who is online

In total there are 42 users online :: 3 registered, 0 hidden and 39 guests


Most users ever online was 218 on Wed Dec 07, 2016 6:58 pm

Registered users: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], Yahoo [Bot] based on users active over the past 5 minutes

The Team
Administrators
Global Moderators
global_moderators.png CS

P-Mix200

Post questions and info about hybrid (compressed gas with fuel) powered cannons here. This includes discussion about fuels, ratios, ignition systems, build types, safety, and anything else relevant.
Sponsored 
  • Author
    Message

Unread postAuthor: HunterT » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:04 am

Fnord wrote:Hunter, he's putting 200bar of fuel/air mix in and igniting it, meaning the pressure will jump to something like 1400-1600 bar when it combusts. Not sure if you caught that, just clarifying.


That's why I suggested the sandbags.
  • 0

User avatar
HunterT
Staff Sergeant
Staff Sergeant
 
Posts: 113
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 9:46 pm
Location: Just east of Russia
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: Petitlu » Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:40 am

I know he has a high risk of explosion!
I'll be shooting Mix100 first, then a Mix200 ...
For the ignition I thought of a spark plug-filament reduced model.
I make this hybrid for science, to satisfy my curiosity but the tests will be done safely!
I may have a problem for the mix as the room is small so if you have any advice ... :)
  • 0

User avatar
Petitlu
Brigadier General
Brigadier General
 
Posts: 807
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:52 am
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: DYI » Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:20 am

Nice to see it finally occurring to someone else that building hybrids running >100X doesn't require witchcraft :wink:

The major design issues with such a hybrid are as follows:

1. Fueling port valve. Pretty much any ball valve, including those rated for 1000 bar, will be destroyed by this application. Use a needle valve with metal-on-metal sealing and the "point" of the needle toward the high pressure side.

2. Burst disc. You'll need a sheet metal disk for this, preferably a "scored" disc which doesn't follow the projectile out the barrel (It looks like a "+" sign cut into the face of the disc). Larda's hybrid didn't do this, but instead used thinner discs which ruptured at lower pressure (and thus decreased performance in some cases).

3. Holding the burst disc. I'd be concerned about even a 6000# (the highest rated "standard" unions available in the US, rated to about 400 bar) union surviving 200X shots. A good high pressure union will probably be fine at 100X though, it's just a matter of seeing how high you can push it (from a safe distance). There's also the option of having a custom machined part made for this.

4. Barrel. Not really much of a choice here. If you haven't already decided to use seamless hydraulic tube... use seamless hydraulic tube.

5. Ignition. Looks like you've already got this pretty much sorted out.


I have quite a bit of experience in the design of high pressure hybrids. If you run into any trouble, just PM me. I'd be happy to help. I don't have much experience with air/propane mixes in very small chambers though - you'll want to talk to SB15 about that, if you end up having mixing problems. He's something of an expert in that field, and he would be very willing to assist you on this :lol:
  • 0

Spudfiles' resident expert on all things that sail through the air at improbable speeds, trailing an incandescent wake of ionized air, dissociated polymers and metal oxides.
User avatar
DYI
Lieutenant General
Lieutenant General
 
Posts: 2861
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2007 8:18 pm
Location: The People's Republic of Canuckistan
Country: Turks and Caicos Islands (tc)
Reputation: 9

Unread postAuthor: Petitlu » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:38 pm

Wouuaaahhh .... everything!
I may be a solution for harbor fueling valve
A quick coupling eighth itself surrounded by a reduction fitting which is closed by a plug ...
And a rifled cal.50 black powder, it would be good? :)
I will see to the mixture ..
Thank you
  • 0

User avatar
Petitlu
Brigadier General
Brigadier General
 
Posts: 807
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:52 am
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: SpudFarm » Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:09 pm

Good luck, I think it might be possible that this holds up. I wouldn`t hold it but its right there on the limit.

I work with hydraulics and you would be amazed to see the wear parts sustain before they fail under normal hydraulic applications (250Bar)

However, I personally would make something to keep everything in place and dampen shock both by the combustion pressure and the thing recoiling into things. a pipe on the outside of it with lead cast inside it around the chamber or something. However, this is just a thought.

Looking forward to the tests, document it well and find a worthy target and projectile on the first test incase it is the last!
  • 0

"Made in France"
- A spud gun insurance.
User avatar
SpudFarm
Donating Member
Donating Member
 
Posts: 2563
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 9:39 am
Location: Norway Trondheim area
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: Petitlu » Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:20 pm

Thank you!
The hose with lead shot is a good idea, as sand bags or two!
tests are still loins!
  • 0

User avatar
Petitlu
Brigadier General
Brigadier General
 
Posts: 807
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:52 am
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: Petitlu » Mon Apr 23, 2012 11:40 am

I put a 6-mm cannon on the P-Mix200, I'll shoot Mix40 to see how it performs ...

Image
  • 0

User avatar
Petitlu
Brigadier General
Brigadier General
 
Posts: 807
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:52 am
Reputation: 0

Sponsored

Sponsor
 


Unread postAuthor: warhead052 » Mon Apr 23, 2012 11:55 am

Looks good! Can't wait to see a video of it!
  • 0


warhead052
Major General
Major General
 
Posts: 1769
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 5:41 pm
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: Petitlu » Mon Apr 23, 2012 12:01 pm

Thank !
I will shoot and make a video on the same day that the Thorjack!
  • 0

User avatar
Petitlu
Brigadier General
Brigadier General
 
Posts: 807
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:52 am
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: SpudFarm » Mon Apr 23, 2012 3:59 pm

Good luck, if it works as expected, try the highest mix you can :)
You might actually be able to impress DYI with a 200x BB shot, and he`s hard to rival with in that playfield!
  • 0

"Made in France"
- A spud gun insurance.
User avatar
SpudFarm
Donating Member
Donating Member
 
Posts: 2563
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 9:39 am
Location: Norway Trondheim area
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: Petitlu » Mon Apr 23, 2012 4:07 pm

Thank you!
I am a small player facing DYI!
:D
I'm curious what will happen if I can Mix200 ...
  • 0

User avatar
Petitlu
Brigadier General
Brigadier General
 
Posts: 807
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:52 am
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: SpudFarm » Mon Apr 23, 2012 4:21 pm

Atleast I think your doing good. You dare to try the (Almost) untried, and that`s what progress is made of.
Also think you have very good build quality, seems like you take your time.
  • 0

"Made in France"
- A spud gun insurance.
User avatar
SpudFarm
Donating Member
Donating Member
 
Posts: 2563
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2006 9:39 am
Location: Norway Trondheim area
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: Petitlu » Mon Apr 23, 2012 4:44 pm

Thank you!
Whatever happens I will not be disappointed with the result ...
  • 0

User avatar
Petitlu
Brigadier General
Brigadier General
 
Posts: 807
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:52 am
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: Petitlu » Tue Apr 24, 2012 5:17 pm

I put a nichrome wire for ignition like that no problem for Mix40

Image
  • 0

User avatar
Petitlu
Brigadier General
Brigadier General
 
Posts: 807
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:52 am
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Tue Apr 24, 2012 11:58 pm

Looks like something out of "Alien" :D
  • 0

User avatar
jackssmirkingrevenge
Donating Member
Donating Member
 
Posts: 24225
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 11:28 pm
Country: Holy See (Vatican City State) (va)
Reputation: 66

PreviousNext

Return to Hybrid Cannon Discussion

Who is online

Registered users: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], Yahoo [Bot]

Reputation System ©'