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9x mix and beyond Pneumatic cilinder

Post questions and info about hybrid (compressed gas with fuel) powered cannons here. This includes discussion about fuels, ratios, ignition systems, build types, safety, and anything else relevant.
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9x mix and beyond Pneumatic cilinder

Unread postAuthor: CannonBall » Tue Jun 19, 2007 8:09 am

Hi guys.. Ive been able to get a pneumatic cilinder from my work.
it can hold 5000 bars burst pressure is 7250 bar.
im gone do a 9x mix and more.
Im gone use gasoline as fuel cause u cant compress it to a liquid only at VERY high pressure.
A standard motor compresses gasoline to 13 to 14 bar with air mixed

Would my chamber hold the pressure?
it is 6.5 cm thick stainless steel
1.2 liter volume


cheers Patrick :twisted:
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Last edited by CannonBall on Thu Jul 26, 2007 4:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Tue Jun 19, 2007 8:22 am

I doubt you'll exceed 500 bar, but make sure your fittings are sound :?
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Unread postAuthor: spudthug » Tue Jun 19, 2007 9:27 am

your gun is only as strong as your weakest link...the number one rule of spudgunning...

have u built a pneumatic or a combustion yet? make sure u research for hours even days before you build a hybrid..

are u sure u r going to be able to ignite gasoline and how are u going to get it into a gas...if u r keeping it as a liquid and then injecting it i am pretty sure it isnt going to work....
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Hybrid- 75% done. need to build propane holder and drill/tap sparkplug hole..
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Unread postAuthor: Jumpin Jehosaphat » Tue Jun 19, 2007 2:43 pm

Now now spudthug just because he doesn't average 10 posts per day doesn't mean he can't handle himself or has never done this before...

I think your chamber can handle the pressure, but fining the rest of the parts you need rated at that kind of pressure is going to be costly. In the end, this will probably cost you hundreds of dollars to build.

You should do a lot of research on fuels, gasoline alone probably isn't enough. Something like jet fuel would be more appropriate under that kind of pressure, not that I know how the hell you are going to get your hands on any such thing.
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Unread postAuthor: CannonBall » Tue Jun 19, 2007 3:25 pm

fittings are no problem i am researching for months now to make a hybrid.and indeed i dont post much cause im reading all the time.
I know very much about high pressures as i am a hobby chemist too that means fabricating energetic materials like ANNM acetonperoxide MHN NG nitrostarch... etc ive done them all cause i did a chemist education.

I know enough about pressure and how to build up pressure.
You dont need jet fuel cause a jet engine doesnt compresses it.... expanding gasses from burned fuel do make pressure as you all know.
But gasoline is the only thing of fuel that is able too reach high pressure without getting liquid.

also im not gone inject liquid gasoline ive got a compresser from my work that can reach up to 50 bars I work with high pressures all the time at my work We lift up Tanktrucks(oil/gasoline trucks) with these cilinders.. there's an adapter that allows you too place a canister of liquid .. it mixes the fuel with air so i dont need to inject a liquid, the only problem is getting the best igniteble mix with air and fuel.

but il solve it..

cheers patrick
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Unread postAuthor: Jumpin Jehosaphat » Tue Jun 19, 2007 3:53 pm

Well you certainly seem to know a lot more about all this than I do. I hope to hear about this gun as you build it. This sounds like it is going to be a great cannon.
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Unread postAuthor: CannonBall » Tue Jun 19, 2007 4:02 pm

I want to reach more then mach2 with this thing.
I also got PURE Nitromethaan 99.9% this wil produce 6x as much gasses as gasoline :twisted:
But it can also detonate for sure cause i use it to sensitize my Ammoniumnitrate for a detonation.
Im probably gone try it as a fuel only minus is the price of nitro... it cost 20 euro's a KG not even a liter :(
Also ive got a Union that has a burst pressure of 500 bars pretty strong.. u cant buy this in a regular store... BUT im proud i have one! :o
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Unread postAuthor: spudthug » Tue Jun 19, 2007 4:25 pm

Now now spudthug just because he doesn't average 10 posts per day doesn't mean he can't handle himself or has never done this before...

I think your chamber can handle the pressure, but fining the rest of the parts you need rated at that kind of pressure is going to be costly. In the end, this will probably cost you hundreds of dollars to build.

You should do a lot of research on fuels, gasoline alone probably isn't enough. Something like jet fuel would be more appropriate under that kind of pressure, not that I know how the hell you are going to get your hands on any such thing.


jj how about u stop telling me to not say things to new people..he is new but he knows about things post count doesnt matter. u have tried to tell me off in like 5 threads yet u have no effing clue what you are talking about and u have built 1 functional gun...and one that u blow into...so u shut the hell up.....

@cannonball

i wasnt trying to get u down or anything i was jsut saying that i didnt know if u could get ur hands on parts that strong+ a compressor to get pressures that high..9x is around 110 psi is it not? a hybrid with 110 psi already in it before combustion happens is scary as hell...u do know about ddt right? because before u go anywhere near 9x u should test immensly from 5x up..like 20 tests+ at each mix above 4x...

and u probably know that remote ignition is a must for anything over a 4x hybrid...
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4" piston valved cannon-half done..( i spilt my cement...)

Hybrid- 75% done. need to build propane holder and drill/tap sparkplug hole..
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Unread postAuthor: dongfang » Tue Jun 19, 2007 5:13 pm

Hi CannonBall,

Sure there is no way in the world you can blow up that cylinder with a gas explosion.

I recall reading a Brazilian guy´s web page. He got a cylinder of the same kind. He used gun cotton as propellant (against the rules of spud shooting I guess). I think he calculated his golf ball to leave at > Mach 2.

I am not going to search for the page now - but he also shot a tennis ball through a door w a normal spud gun using pure oxygen, and built an electromagnetic rail gun.

Regards
Soren
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Unread postAuthor: Jumpin Jehosaphat » Tue Jun 19, 2007 5:36 pm

spudthug wrote:jj how about u stop telling me to not say things to new people..he is new but he knows about things post count doesnt matter. u have tried to tell me off in like 5 threads yet u have no effing clue what you are talking about and u have built 1 functional gun...and one that u blow into...so u shut the hell up.....

No need to come unhinged kiddo. Few flame wars seem to erupt on this site which is a good thing, and I think we ought to keep it that way. :roll:
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Unread postAuthor: Fnord » Tue Jun 19, 2007 5:52 pm

I would use pure propane+oxygen(or O3) rather than gasoline.
Maybe I'm missing something really obvious, but isnt gasoline a liquid at room temperature?

9x of propane and pure oxygen would probably give you a few thousand psi(downloading gasEQ right now).

Too bad you cant compress acetylene, that would give you interesting results :)
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Unread postAuthor: sandman » Tue Jun 19, 2007 6:37 pm

dongfang wrote:Hi CannonBall,

Sure there is no way in the world you can blow up that cylinder with a gas explosion.

I recall reading a Brazilian guy´s web page. He got a cylinder of the same kind. He used gun cotton as propellant (against the rules of spud shooting I guess). I think he calculated his golf ball to leave at > Mach 2.

I am not going to search for the page now - but he also shot a tennis ball through a door w a normal spud gun using pure oxygen, and built an electromagnetic rail gun.

Regards
Soren


yes, Sam from www.powerlabs.com, and he is my idol:oops: , i am trying most of the stuff he does and i love it, and as soon as i get some nitric acid, im makin supersonic golf balls
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Unread postAuthor: boilingleadbath » Tue Jun 19, 2007 9:06 pm

Increased initial pressures don't make DDT occur much faster (in most fuel-air mixtures).

We've discussed it <a href="http://www.spudfiles.com/spudtech_archive/viewtopic.php?t=14818">before</a>
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Unread postAuthor: Flying_Salt » Tue Jun 19, 2007 9:18 pm

Jumpin Jehosaphat wrote:Few flame wars seem to erupt on this site which is a good thing, and I think we ought to keep it that way. :roll:

Then you've obviously missed the days of spudstuff and dan003004...

Anywhoo, I think that if you know what you're doing with injecting the gasoline, you should be fine. Do you have a picture of the cylinder? I've always wanted to see something that holds a couple thousand psi.

As for alternative fuels, uranium, anybody?
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Unread postAuthor: Killjoy » Wed Jun 20, 2007 12:25 am

Another alternative fuel, methane. Buy a cow and get it for free (unless you count the price of the cow).
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