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UHMW test rounds

Post about things you have launched or thought about launching. Also post about various materials used for building cannons. No posts about explosive projectiles!
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Unread postAuthor: Technician1002 » Sun May 17, 2009 8:22 pm

USGF wrote:The intent is to gauge interest in the various rounds. The giant lead pellets, though popular, we suspect will be too pricey to sell in quantity. These UHMW rounds will undergo more testing. More sizes will be made. Currently, all are machined on a large CNC lathe. It can handle up to 3.5" OD continuous bar stock. To lower cost to the end user, we are investigating the possibility of other production methods to produce the pellets in various shapes and sizes.


Have you considered making various size pistons for sale? Would there be enough interest to make both traditional rubber face pistons as well as dual o ring spool pistons for those who want to build either a shureshot type propane meter or QDV?
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Unread postAuthor: USGF » Sun May 17, 2009 9:10 pm

Technician1002 wrote:
USGF wrote:The intent is to gauge interest in the various rounds. The giant lead pellets, though popular, we suspect will be too pricey to sell in quantity. These UHMW rounds will undergo more testing. More sizes will be made. Currently, all are machined on a large CNC lathe. It can handle up to 3.5" OD continuous bar stock. To lower cost to the end user, we are investigating the possibility of other production methods to produce the pellets in various shapes and sizes.


Have you considered making various size pistons for sale? Would there be enough interest to make both traditional rubber face pistons as well as dual o ring spool pistons for those who want to build either a shureshot type propane meter or QDV?


Tech, I can't really answer for Mike. We have the capacity and capabilty of making all those parts. Really depends on demand. If we are making a few metric parts, a few obscure parts for customers in far flung areas, No. However, if we are to mass produce a "standard kit" of some sort, Yes. Mike is researching and gauging interest in what sizes and type of parts we should produce. We are the factory side of the operation. 8)
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Unread postAuthor: thedeathofall » Sun May 17, 2009 11:16 pm

These look really nice. I mean REALLY nice!

Another option people might like, is a cheaper material. On Mcmaster I found 5/8 inch pvc rod for $0.97 a foot. With a little machining, this could be turned into the same type of bullet for 1/2 inch sch 40 pipe. That means that the material itself only costs about $0.08 per bullet (if making 1 inch bullets). These wont be indestructible, but still very durable, and you can sell them at a price that makes them affordable for single shot use.

just my $0.02
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Unread postAuthor: Lentamentalisk » Sun May 17, 2009 11:22 pm

Well the entire point of these rounds is that they are heavy, and indestructible. The main cost is not the materials, but the labor. Honestly, did you see the dent that the round put in that iron? PVC isn't going to do that.

If you want to make your own, go ahead and do that, but as for me, if I am going to go through all of the effort to have something shipped to my house, it had damn well better last more than a few shots!
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Unread postAuthor: jagerbond » Sun May 17, 2009 11:43 pm

thedeathofall wrote:These look really nice. I mean REALLY nice!

Another option people might like, is a cheaper material. On Mcmaster I found 5/8 inch pvc rod for $0.97 a foot. With a little machining, this could be turned into the same type of bullet for 1/2 inch sch 40 pipe. That means that the material itself only costs about $0.08 per bullet (if making 1 inch bullets). These wont be indestructible, but still very durable, and you can sell them at a price that makes them affordable for single shot use.

just my $0.02


Also on McMaster UHMW is $.86 a foot for 1/2" and has a +tolerance include an O-ring for $.02. This round would be re-usable if found. The benefit, is modifying to repeatably carry your choice of alternative materials. PVC would last one shot and shatter. I could go on and on about UHMW.... Its something I have experience with, read about, but still does not translate to impressiveness of 1st hand experience.

We will make assorted sizes for reasonable prices based on reductive machining and seek alternatives for more economical solutions.

Mike
Sureshot / http://www.ultimatespudgun.com
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Unread postAuthor: thedeathofall » Sun May 17, 2009 11:44 pm

That is true, but they will cost at least $4 each. A 1 inch steel ball bearing will do the same damage for about $1-$1.25 each. and it will be usable 20 times longer than the plastic round.

At one point or another, the polyethylene round will fail, aso a lot of people will be using softer targets and backstops. If you use a target/backstop that is soft enough to take the blow, and not hurt the UHMW bullet, it should be soft enough for a PVC bullet as well.


@ Lent

If I had machining equipment, or even a drill press, i would probably just shut up and make some, but i don't. I just thought Mike and the others might be interested in what i had to say as a potential costumer :wink:



Also, maybe instead of a 1/2 inch rod, you can insert 3/4 or even 1 inch steel ball bearings in the tips. That would increase weight, but the steel would take most of the damage, and help protect the polyethylene.

Its just a nice little thought anyway..
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Unread postAuthor: jmccalip » Mon May 18, 2009 12:48 am

Now what's wrong with golf balls? I can probably get a couple dozen range balls for a few dollars.
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Unread postAuthor: USGF » Mon May 18, 2009 12:49 am

thedeathofall wrote:That is true, but they will cost at least $4 each. A 1 inch steel ball bearing will do the same damage for about $1-$1.25 each. and it will be usable 20 times longer than the plastic round.

At one point or another, the polyethylene round will fail, aso a lot of people will be using softer targets and backstops. If you use a target/backstop that is soft enough to take the blow, and not hurt the UHMW bullet, it should be soft enough for a PVC bullet as well.


@ Lent

If I had machining equipment, or even a drill press, i would probably just shut up and make some, but i don't. I just thought Mike and the others might be interested in what i had to say as a potential costumer :wink:



Also, maybe instead of a 1/2 inch rod, you can insert 3/4 or even 1 inch steel ball bearings in the tips. That would increase weight, but the steel would take most of the damage, and help protect the polyethylene.

Its just a nice little thought anyway..



40 cents maybe but not $4.00. We have machines that will cut these without human intervention. No labor means lower cost. At about a $1.00 a foot shipped, we can get around 8 to 9 rounds per foot. So, 12 cents for material, 2 cents for an o-ring if they insist and the balance is wear and tear on the machines. BTW, UHMW and the like are many times more durable as projectiles than PVC. PVC will shatter on impact. UHMW , HDPE will deform maybe but not shatter.

Golf Balls are a standardized diameter +-. Mike is intending to make all sorts of differing sizes.
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Unread postAuthor: jagerbond » Mon May 18, 2009 5:30 am

jmccalip wrote:Now what's wrong with golf balls? I can probably get a couple dozen range balls for a few dollars.


I suppose we could try to machine golf balls to fit smaller sizes :lol:

Mike
Sureshot / http://www.ultimatespudgun.com
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Unread postAuthor: rp181 » Mon May 18, 2009 7:38 am

No one said anything is wrong, is there something wrong with having a choice of what to use?
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Unread postAuthor: jrrdw » Mon May 18, 2009 7:40 am

jagerbond wrote:
jmccalip wrote:Now what's wrong with golf balls? I can probably get a couple dozen range balls for a few dollars.


I suppose we could try to machine golf balls to fit smaller sizes :lol:

Mike
Sureshot / http://www.ultimatespudgun.com


Anything below the dimple depth will probly tear the covering. Thats my guess.
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Unread postAuthor: jmccalip » Mon May 18, 2009 9:08 am

USGF wrote:
40 cents maybe but not $4.00. We have machines that will cut these without human intervention. No labor means lower cost. At about a $1.00 a foot shipped, we can get around 8 to 9 rounds per foot. So, 12 cents for material, 2 cents for an o-ring if they insist and the balance is wear and tear on the machines. BTW, UHMW and the like are many times more durable as projectiles than PVC. PVC will shatter on impact. UHMW , HDPE will deform maybe but not shatter.

Golf Balls are a standardized diameter +-. Mike is intending to make all sorts of differing sizes.


Well, I guess if the price is right I could buy some.


Now this might seem a little far fetched, but do y'all think it would be possible to hollow out the inside and make room for a parachute? I've seen threads pop up about this subject before, so I think there's a reasonable amount of interest.

We have machines that will cut these without human intervention.


Gantry loaders, eh? 8) Bar feeders don't count! :wink:
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Last edited by jmccalip on Mon May 18, 2009 2:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Unread postAuthor: thedeathofall » Mon May 18, 2009 1:11 pm

We will be retailing these for $4 a piece.


I was talking about the 2" bullets when i said $4 because that is what Mike said they would be priced at.

The rest of the time i was talking about 0.5 inch pvc rod for bullets. I understand that pvc would shatter on impact. it was just a thought.

After looking at McMaster again, i realise the PVC wouldn't be worth it. I found UHMW polyethylene in the same 5/8 inch diameter for $1.22 per foot. That is only $0.25 more per foot.

Making 1 inch bullets, that would cost about $0.11 per bullet. So you could theoretically sell these for $0.50- $0.75 each and still make a decent profit.

So we should all just forget about my random pvc ramblings... (that makes sense right?)
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Unread postAuthor: USGF » Mon May 18, 2009 2:40 pm

jmccalip wrote:Now this might seem a little far fetched, but do y'all think it would be possible to hollow out the inside and make room for a parashoot? I've seen threads pop up about this subject before, so I think there's a reasonable amount of interest.

We have machines that will cut these without human intervention.


Gantry loaders, eh? 8) Bar feeders don't count! :wink:



Jim, The skirt end of the 2" round has a 1.5 diameter relief 1" deep. If you can load a parachute in there, there you go. How do you eject it? I 'm guessing a model rocket style chute.

Yes we have bar feeders for 1st op. However, we have other devices for additional ops. :lol:
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Unread postAuthor: jagerbond » Tue May 19, 2009 12:26 am

Thanks for everyone's interest. I posted the 1.5", 1.7" and 2" varieties on the web site. http://ultimatespudgun.com/index.php?cPath=50 .5, .75", 1", 2.5", 3" material is on the way.

Mike
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