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Invisibility Research

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Unread postAuthor: rp181 » Tue Aug 12, 2008 12:06 pm

Psycix:

It WOULD work for stealth because Radar is another frequency. If the waves went around, theres none to be reflected back.
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Unread postAuthor: Ragnarok » Tue Aug 12, 2008 12:41 pm

rp181 wrote:It WOULD work for stealth because Radar is another frequency. If the waves went around, theres none to be reflected back.

That's possibly the most practical use of the technology - radar is a longer wavelength than visible light, and so the technology to make a meta-material that deflected it would be much cheaper - it also wouldn't be forced to render anyone inside it blind.

Given the importance of radar these days, something that was completely invisible to it (unlike most stealth planes, which aren't totally "invisible") would be very frightening to anyone who knew they were being used against them.
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Unread postAuthor: psycix » Tue Aug 12, 2008 4:23 pm

Hmm I forgot how radar worked and didn't have the time to think about that :tard:
I agree on that with the proper tweaking, it may also bend radar waves.

But then the question is, how many different frequencies can be bent?
Could the same material bend both visible light and radar?
And if you want to spot an invisible object, you could always pick another frequency: X-ray, ultraviolet or even gamma radiation, whatever floats your boat.

Another question that comes up on me:
If it has to be an rigid object of an specific shape (a sphere, or maybe some weird shape) would the object have to be aimed at the spectator?
Said in another way: is the invisible object still invisible if you look at it from another direction?
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Unread postAuthor: DYI » Tue Aug 12, 2008 4:45 pm

Ultraviolet may be viable, but gamma radiation will go right through most things - not the greatest if you want to detect something by bouncing a signal off it :roll:
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Unread postAuthor: SEAKING9006 » Tue Aug 12, 2008 5:35 pm

@ psycix
Yes, it is still invisible from all directions. If you wrap an entire object in a cloak that makes you only see the light emitted behind it, if you move to another angle, that angle must also have a 'behind' to it, so it will still be invisible.

@all
However, I don't like to use the word 'invisible' in this context. What it would be more akin to would be Covenant Active Camouflage. You aren't made invisible- your chances of being visually detected are reduced, and that cloaking factor is exponentially decreased as movement increases and as distance from the intended detector decreases.

Therefore, because of the limited cloaking ability of such a technology, I believe that civilians will indeed have access to this technology, because it will only help against being spotted, like a high tech gillie suit, and nothing more. Furthermore, it was developed by civilians. Also, if things that made crime more easily committed without consequences were regularly restricted, we wouldn't be able to order Kevlar from McMaster. Also, Class 3 (fully automatic or suppressed) firearms are not restricted due to their ability to increase ones ability to commit crime, but their ability to kill if put in the wrong hands. But, then again, when you put politics into it.....
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Unread postAuthor: Ragnarok » Wed Aug 13, 2008 4:12 am

SEAKING9006 wrote:@all: Therefore, because of the limited cloaking ability of such a technology, I believe that civilians will indeed have access to this technology.

It is entirely possible to make something 100% invisible in the visible region with this technology if you have produced the barrier well enough.

Civilians have few practical legal uses for it that cannot be performed perfectly sufficently by a ghillie suit - go on, give me some good ones.
Therefore the only reasons that would require it's possession over a ghillie suit are likely illegal. Judging by some of what I've read in this thread, if some of you got the stuff, you'd just go and ogle naked women (which legally is a breach of privacy).

The next problem after whether it will be legal is likely be cost - the price will be prohibitive - thousands, if not millions of dollars, for many years.
And by the time the price has come down, there will be ways to combat it.

It is possibly conceivable that a deliberately lesser version that gives that sort of bizarre glass look like (as you said) you get from Halo's optic camouflage, usable against animals, but noticeable to an attentive human - might be made available, but I still have doubts.

Also, if things that made crime more easily committed without consequences were regularly restricted, we wouldn't be able to order Kevlar from McMaster.

US law in several states has penalties for possession or use of body armor by felons.
In short, if you use the stuff during a crime, you increase your potential sentence (if they don't just shoot you in the head).

At the least, I could expect penalties at least as heavy for abusing metamaterials.

Personally, I think the most useful metamaterials, rather than the light bending ones, are the negative magnetic ones - the ones that move out of magnetic fields - it opens possibilities for frictionless magnetic bearings and all kinds of advanced technologies.
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Unread postAuthor: ramses » Wed Aug 13, 2008 1:57 pm

@ Ragnarok- using a metamaterial that affects radar on a plane would "blind" it's radar, too. Just thought I'd point that out...
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Unread postAuthor: Ragnarok » Wed Aug 13, 2008 2:30 pm

ramses wrote:@ Ragnarok- using a metamaterial that affects radar on a plane would "blind" it's radar, too. Just thought I'd point that out...

You're missing something important.

If you had radar on a stealth vehicle (whatever that is), sending out the radar waves would just be broadcasting something your foe can pick up on. You do not broadcast anything you can avoid.
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Unread postAuthor: ALIHISGREAT » Wed Aug 13, 2008 2:54 pm

the only aplication that seems reasonable is camoflage fro infantry soldiers (for obvious reasons) and even if it was bright pink it would still be better than ACU :lol:
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Unread postAuthor: ramses » Wed Aug 13, 2008 3:02 pm

yeah, I guess that would be like dressing in all black at night while holding a lit road flare... :oops:
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Unread postAuthor: TurboSuper » Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:31 pm

I bet Criss Angel could do some fun things with that stuff...
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Unread postAuthor: frankrede » Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:10 pm

TurboSuper wrote:I bet Criss Angel could do some fun things with that stuff...
Oh don't get me started on him. He so bogus
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Unread postAuthor: Ragnarok » Thu Aug 14, 2008 4:22 am

Hmm, that brings up an interesting point. If people know that invisibility materials are in existence, then stage magicians are going to have a hard time.

There's no fun in watching a show where you know they could just hide someone like that - there has to be a mundane trick that doesn't use any thing more complex than smoke and/or mirrors.
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Unread postAuthor: psycix » Thu Aug 14, 2008 5:07 am

Ragnarok wrote:Hmm, that brings up an interesting point. If people know that invisibility materials are in existence, then stage magicians are going to have a hard time.

Hmm yes.
Well, you can always test it:
After the magician re-opened the door of the box the beautiful just girl stepped in and the box appears empty, just throw a rock. :D

"Tadaaa and shes gone!"
-Hey thats fake!
"No its not! Shes gone, you see?"
-Oh yeah?
*Thud* :roll:
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