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Unread postAuthor: boyntonstu » Thu Dec 02, 2010 5:40 pm

Cork Fork on Slingshot on a Stick

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWNL9hnlD3g[/youtube]

This new fork design lets the pouch through the goal posts without hitting the cross bar.

Very easy to build cheap, strong, light, extremely easy to draw, very steady to aim.

I think that you might enjoy shooting it.
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Unread postAuthor: omniscient » Thu Dec 02, 2010 8:46 pm

:shock:
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Unread postAuthor: saefroch » Thu Dec 02, 2010 9:20 pm

The new fork design reminds me of the "W" slingshot design. Is this a prototype, that it does not yet have the pouch-holding mechanism, or is that a permanent change?
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Unread postAuthor: boyntonstu » Thu Dec 02, 2010 11:55 pm

saefroch wrote:The new fork design reminds me of the "W" slingshot design. Is this a prototype, that it does not yet have the pouch-holding mechanism, or is that a permanent change?


No more triggers, a permanent change.

The Stick allows you to hold a slingshot that is drawn to 48" with one hand.

Also, there is no possibility of hitting anything between the goal posts with the Stick.


However, the major difference of the Stick is that it allows you to use your muscles at better angles for an easier draw and aim.

Make one and try it, you will be amazed.
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Unread postAuthor: saefroch » Fri Dec 03, 2010 7:48 am

I just liked the idea of holding a crossbow, rather than holding something back at full draw. Seems like a MUCH more ergonomic design to me.

Draw length barely matters at all, for it is the draw weight. Your draw length, for maximum efficiency, should be about your height (assuming slingshots are anything like a bow).
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Unread postAuthor: more_eggs » Fri Dec 03, 2010 7:54 am

omniscient wrote::shock:


LOL :D :D
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Unread postAuthor: boyntonstu » Fri Dec 03, 2010 3:57 pm

saefroch wrote:I just liked the idea of holding a crossbow, rather than holding something back at full draw. Seems like a MUCH more ergonomic design to me.

Draw length barely matters at all, for it is the draw weight. Your draw length, for maximum efficiency, should be about your height (assuming slingshots are anything like a bow).


Look at the video.

Does it appear that a lot of effort is required to hold the draw weight?
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Unread postAuthor: saefroch » Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:46 pm

No, it doesn't appear that a lot of effort is required to hold the draw weight, but isn't draw weight directly proportional to launch velocity on a slingshot?
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Unread postAuthor: boyntonstu » Fri Dec 03, 2010 6:10 pm

saefroch wrote:No, it doesn't appear that a lot of effort is required to hold the draw weight, but isn't draw weight directly proportional to launch velocity on a slingshot?


The Stick holds the draw weight because my palm is resting at its end.

You could never do what I show in the video with a regular slingshot, especially for the butterfly draw.

Try it and see it for yourself.
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Unread postAuthor: saefroch » Fri Dec 03, 2010 6:55 pm

boyntonstu wrote:The Stick holds the draw weight because my palm is resting at its end.
But don't you feel the pouch being pulled out of your fingers? I'm not questioning that this design isn't easier to use at higher draw weights than a standard slingshot, but it doesn't seem very practical to me to be holding onto the pouch all the while, when you can use a trigger mechanism to hold it for you.
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Unread postAuthor: boyntonstu » Fri Dec 03, 2010 8:42 pm

saefroch wrote:
boyntonstu wrote:The Stick holds the draw weight because my palm is resting at its end.
But don't you feel the pouch being pulled out of your fingers? I'm not questioning that this design isn't easier to use at higher draw weights than a standard slingshot, but it doesn't seem very practical to me to be holding onto the pouch all the while, when you can use a trigger mechanism to hold it for you.


Time at draw is your enemy.

The time that it takes to load and cock a trigger is the time that power is lost in the elastic.

If you do not have to hold the entire draw, you will discover that just holding the pouch is negligible.

Try it and see for your self.

Take your slingshot and grip it in a vice.
(or place it on the ground and step on the handle)

Place a piece of wood the length of your draw against the fork and draw the pouch.

Is it easier to hold?
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Unread postAuthor: saefroch » Fri Dec 03, 2010 9:17 pm

boyntonstu wrote:The time that it takes to load and cock a trigger is the time that power is lost in the elastic.
This makes no sense at all to me. There is no energy lost to the elastic by you taking your jolly time drawing it. Care to explain?

boyntonstu wrote:Is it easier to hold?
Well of course it's easier to hold, I'm not challenging that by any means. But it's certainly easier not to have to hold back the pouch at all and use a trigger mechanism. There's no significant loss to using a trigger, since the difference is gone once the pouch leaves the restraint, it accelerates the same.

Do you like having ridiculously long posts?

Because you keep typing out paragraphs broken up into individual sentences.

It's just a little weird.

I've never seen anyone else break up a post like that.

Or talk like that, for that matter.

To me, it just takes up space needlessly.

See? Now I created a post much like yours.

I'd recommended not quoting my entire post next time :wink:.
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Unread postAuthor: boyntonstu » Fri Dec 03, 2010 10:01 pm

Richard Middleton's book "Man Powered Weapons and Ammunition, page 62:

"The highest velocities are achieved by a 'snatch' release,... My Hodges 42-inch draw device, with its mechanical release mechanism and spreader, took 20 seconds from the moment of stretching to the moment of aimed release through the chronograph,time for an enormous loss of heat energy to the air.

Middleton's measurements prove the necessity of a quick draw and release and the reason why triggers ruin the possibility of high speeds and power.
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Unread postAuthor: saefroch » Fri Dec 03, 2010 10:57 pm

His numbers don't make sense. Try to throw in a best-fit line. It's probably a quadratic function, based on Newton's Law of Cooling. Throwing the data he gives into my graphing calculator, I get a quadratic equation, and graph it.

I conclude his data makes no sense, for the best-fit line predicts that after about 11.5 seconds, launch velocity would be zero. The best-fit line is also very perfect... y = 2/3x^2 - 20/3x + 168. My calculator will not construct a cubic or quartic best-fit line, probably because it needs more points than three.

The data seems to show a loss of launch velocity, and yes, this makes sense. But the numbers don't add up. The loss should be decreasing as a function of time, not increasing. The material providing the force will cool slower as it approaches the temperature of its surroundings, not faster.

I don't know who would want to walk around carrying over a hundred pounds in their fingers when they can let it sit on a trigger.

So is Mr. Middleton where you get your love of grains from?
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Unread postAuthor: boyntonstu » Sat Dec 04, 2010 8:26 am

I don't know who would want to walk around carrying over a hundred pounds in their fingers when they can let it sit on a trigger.

Neither do I.

I would rather walk around with a light weapon that can be instantly drawn with ease and fired with its maximum energy output.

Can you think of a way to build a mechanism that will assist your fingers holding the pouch without any moving parts?

Using this device will eliminate almost all the force necessary to hold back the pouch.

(The majority of rubber force is already held back by the Stick as the video shows me using a single hand hold at full draw.)

Crossbows are not slingshots and slingshots are not crossbows.

The difference is rubber vs non-rubber.
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