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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Sun Sep 18, 2011 5:01 am

Tribalism and prejudice are innate in humans, in some ways they are beneficial traits in evolutionary terms, whether they are ethical or not.

when I go flatting


I had to look this up :D "to leave the parental home and live independently in a flat, usually with people of the same age group"
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Unread postAuthor: jsefcik » Sun Sep 18, 2011 6:12 am

I had an entire gun collection stOlen frOm my house worth 15,000 and got nothing back , since you got cameras ,don't forget the shotgun to stop them
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Unread postAuthor: Brian the brain » Sun Sep 18, 2011 6:26 am

Racism is stupid.

All men are created equal.


While some women are better than others.... :wink:
:D

But that is besides the point.

Tribalism and prejudice are innate in humans, in some ways they are beneficial traits in evolutionary terms, whether they are ethical or not.


The same can be said about murder or... stealing.
Wich should put us back on topic.
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Unread postAuthor: jrrdw » Sun Sep 18, 2011 6:27 am

This makes a great case for engraving ID numbers in undisclosed locations on your belongings. Whether it be your home address, drivers licenses number or what ever ID marking you choose. It only takes a few minutes to do.
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Unread postAuthor: Fnord » Sun Sep 18, 2011 9:38 am

Ebay, craigslist, local classifieds. I remember somebody on here had a bunch of stuff stolen from their shed and caught the guys a few days later when they tried to post it for sale in the newspaper.


Anybody know how US law defines automated sentry guns? Even if it was just a paintball gun loaded with pepper balls, I think it would have the desired effect.
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Unread postAuthor: ramses » Sun Sep 18, 2011 1:04 pm

Fnord wrote:Ebay, craigslist, local classifieds. I remember somebody on here had a bunch of stuff stolen from their shed and caught the guys a few days later when they tried to post it for sale in the newspaper.


Anybody know how US law defines automated sentry guns? Even if it was just a paintball gun loaded with pepper balls, I think it would have the desired effect.


Or some kind of ink/ permanent marking device.

boobytraps are illegal internationally (geneva convention), and are defined as:
any concealed or camouflaged device designed to cause bodily injury when triggered by any action of a person making contact with the device.


If a person sets up such a trap to protect his/her property, he/she will be liable for any injury or death even to an unwanted intruder such as a burglar. It is illegal to set a booby trap on one's own property to prevent intruders.



So don't disguise it, and don't let them touch it.
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Sun Sep 18, 2011 1:09 pm

ramses wrote:So don't disguise it, and don't let them touch it.


A clearly marked turret that looks like a turret is pretty menacing anyway, I don't see why you'd want to hide it. In fact, putting a fake gun barrel and a laser pointer would probably be just as effective.

Some big "these premises are protected by automatic sentry guns" would be cool too.
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Unread postAuthor: Technician1002 » Sun Sep 18, 2011 5:35 pm

ramses wrote:boobytraps are illegal internationally (geneva convention), and are defined as:
any concealed or camouflaged device designed to cause bodily injury when triggered by any action of a person making contact with the device.


If a person sets up such a trap to protect his/her property, he/she will be liable for any injury or death even to an unwanted intruder such as a burglar. It is illegal to set a booby trap on one's own property to prevent intruders.



So don't disguise it, and don't let them touch it.


There was a case a few a few years ago. A ham radio operator had someone try to steal his 2 way radio out of his car. The thief tried to cut the transmitter power supply wire with his pocket knife and was killed when he cut into a several hundred volt line.

The kid's family sued. The ham won because the car window was clearly marked "Danger High Voltage" and the radio was clearly marked "Disconnect the power and discharge the high voltage before servicing" and "Service by Authorized Personnel Only" The car was locked. The family lost for the same reason they can't win in cases of copper theft from locked energized power substations. It was marked and locked. It was not a trap. The radio operator was not required to leave the trunk mounted power supply shut off when not in use.

More thieves should remove themselves from the gene pool. Warning linked photo may be NSFW.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads13/electrocution_dead_guy1220023412.jpg
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Unread postAuthor: mattyzip77 » Sun Sep 18, 2011 5:39 pm

sorry for your loss, my condolences. :(
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Unread postAuthor: Zeus » Sun Sep 18, 2011 5:52 pm

Any concealed or camouflaged device designed to cause bodily injury when triggered by any action of a person making contact with the device


So what does the Geneva Convention say about landmines?

Watching Jag recently, I was reminded of landmines
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/sarcasm, /hyperbole
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Unread postAuthor: MrCrowley » Sun Sep 18, 2011 6:02 pm

Technician1002 wrote:[
There was a case a few a few years ago. A ham radio operator had someone try to steal his 2 way radio out of his car. The thief tried to cut the transmitter power supply wire with his pocket knife and was killed when he cut into a several hundred volt line.

The kid's family sued. The ham won because the car window was clearly marked "Danger High Voltage" and the radio was clearly marked "Disconnect the power and discharge the high voltage before servicing" and "Service by Authorized Personnel Only" The car was locked. The family lost for the same reason they can't win in cases of copper theft from locked energized power substations. It was marked and locked. It was not a trap. The radio operator was not required to leave the trunk mounted power supply shut off when not in use.

More thieves should remove themselves from the gene pool. Warning linked photo may be NSFW.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads13/electrocution_dead_guy1220023412.jpg

I'm surprised that in a country when some states allow you to shoot dead an intruder, you can be sued for having hundreds of volts running through a cable attached to a radio.

Since no one in New Zealand really sues each other like they do in America, I doubt we'd have the same problem here even if there were no warning stickers. The police would probably be forced to drop the charges as soon as the media got a hold of it.

I don't think the Ham radio guy should be required to notify people of the dangers aside from mechanics or someone doing work on the car. If someone converted a 12v fridge to 240v and the thief had reason to believe that type of fridge should be running on 12v and proceeded to cut the power cord, his family shouldn't be able to sue IMHO.
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Unread postAuthor: Technician1002 » Sun Sep 18, 2011 6:07 pm

The family was able to sue. They lost because;

It was clearly marked,
It was locked,
The media was invited.

On that note, my car has not only 120 VAC wired in it, as a Hybrid it has ~260 Volts DC. Don't cut any AC cords or the Orange DC cables.


Don't mess with the orange wires.
http://priuschat.com/forums/attachments/prius-phev-plug-in-modifications/20891d1262724745-first-enginer-plug-in-hybrid-electric-vehicle-install-in-portland-area-gen2-pigtail.jpg
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Last edited by Technician1002 on Sun Sep 18, 2011 6:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Unread postAuthor: POLAND_SPUD » Sun Sep 18, 2011 6:10 pm

ohh speaking of booby traps... (lol my hands are booby traps :wink: lol I can't believe I never noticed that there is 'booby' in 'booby trap')
.....I've just noticed that PIR sensors are getting ridiculously cheap (~7$)

so
A Passive Infrared sensor + solenoid valve = instant paintball claymore mine ??

well even if it was designed only to produce a loud BANG it would be pretty cool and effective
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Unread postAuthor: MrCrowley » Sun Sep 18, 2011 6:15 pm

Technician1002 wrote:The family was able to sue.

Yes, I'm aware the family was able to sue. My argument was that it was surprising they were able to sue considering laws in some American states that allow you to shoot dead intruders.

Elaborating on that argument; the family of a robber who is shot dead for trespassing on private property isn't able to sue the owner because the robber should expect to meet deadly force when robbing a house whereas he should not expect to be electrocuted when stealing a radio?

This isn't an argument against your story or anything, I just thought it was interesting that the family were even allowed to present civil action against the radio guy.

Edit:
It was locked

IMHO, if the car was unlocked the family still shouldn't have been able to sue/still should've lost the case. It's okay to steal the radio from a car if the car is unlocked, it's fair game? One is not allowed to shoot a trespasser dead if the house is unlocked?*


*I'm aware that this case you are talking about may not have occurred in a state that allows one to defend their property with lethal force.
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Unread postAuthor: Technician1002 » Sun Sep 18, 2011 6:46 pm

The states have "Attractive Nuisance" laws. It is why substations are locked and you can be sued when a neighbor kid jumps the short fence and drowns in your backyard pool.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attractive ... e_doctrine

If stealing a radio was not obviously dangerous, you can be sued. This is what the case was about. Stealing a radio was not am obvious lethal act. The value was the attraction. The labels made the danger known. Breaking in showed a clear case of ignoring the danger signs. It was not an accidental death.

While putting up a sign to warn children regarding the danger of the land may exempt the landowner from liability, it will not work in all situations.[citation needed] This is particularly true when the child cannot read the sign. Usually the landowner must take some more affirmative steps to protect children.


The locked car was the key in this case and all the wiring was under the dash and not exposed. The kid had to pull out the wire to cut it.
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Last edited by Technician1002 on Sun Sep 18, 2011 6:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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