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salt peter

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salt peter

Unread postAuthor: Deko » Mon Feb 05, 2007 8:31 pm

i want to get some salt peter but im not sure where to look for it, before i go driving around for a long time can anyone tell me what kind of store would carry it?

thanks
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Unread postAuthor: A-98 » Mon Feb 05, 2007 8:41 pm

BCvids sells it. other than that i dunno
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Unread postAuthor: dungdue0 » Mon Feb 05, 2007 9:18 pm

You can get it at Lowe's or Wall Mart, it's in this stuff called stump remover. It's like 5 bucks for a quart of it. I think it's 99% pure salt peter, works great for me.
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Unread postAuthor: Deko » Mon Feb 05, 2007 9:32 pm

ok ill most likely just get some stump remover then thanks dungdue0
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Unread postAuthor: noname » Tue Feb 06, 2007 5:05 pm

Stump Remover is usually between 5 and $6 per pound. At <a href="www.bcarms.com">BCArms,</a> you can buy better quality KNO3 for a cheaper price.
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Unread postAuthor: Deko » Tue Feb 06, 2007 5:15 pm

how much would it be from bcarms including shipping?
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Unread postAuthor: Killjoy » Tue Feb 06, 2007 5:18 pm

united nuclear or skylighter.com is were ive gotten all of my stuff. United nuclear is kinda expensive, but its all top quality. Skylighter is reasonably priced and all its chemicals are top quality also and they also have certain substances which are now hard to find, such as german aluminum (perfect for flash powder).
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Unread postAuthor: Deko » Tue Feb 06, 2007 5:50 pm

thanks killjoy im gonna check those out
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Unread postAuthor: Killjoy » Tue Feb 06, 2007 6:03 pm

yeah sure man glad to help, i just checked out skylighter though and you can no longer purchase german aluminum for your first order because they want to prevent individuals making explosive devices from purchasing the stuff to make it.
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Unread postAuthor: SpudBlaster15 » Tue Feb 06, 2007 9:27 pm

KNO3 based stump remover is only sold in the United States, so I find it easier to make it. With a few instant cold packs (NH4NO3), and some dietary salt substitute (KCl), you can make it via a double displacement reaction. Simply dissolve stoichiometric quantities of the chemicals in some hot (~50C) water, then cool the solution in a freezer. A layer of crystals will form. Filter, wash, and dry these crystals, and your done.
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Unread postAuthor: Deko » Wed Feb 07, 2007 6:02 pm

well i may try that just for fun but for now ill either get stump remover or order from skylighter or unitednuclear
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Unread postAuthor: judgment_arms » Wed Feb 07, 2007 7:45 pm

Hehehe, saltpeter, I can tell you how to make it from stuff found around your house, especially if you have pets…
You ever wondered were people got it 300 hundred years ago, In bat caves! (not the bat cave, but bat caves, as were bats live.) It’s made from dung, crap, poop, what ever you want to call it. I’m to lazy to type it when I can copy it…
Saltpeter, or niter, is the common name for potassium nitrate. Biringuccio tels us how to extract it in his Pirotechnia:
As I told you in the chapter on salts, saltpeter is a mixture composed of many substances extracted with fire and water from arid and manurial soils, from that growth which exudes from new walls or from that loosened soil that is found in tombs or uninhabited caves where the rain cannot enter. It is my belief that it is engendered in these soils from an airy moisture that is drunk in and absorbed by the earthy dryness...
Biringuccio goes on to desrcibe a process for extracting saltpeter from this "manurial soil," i.e. soil that has formed from human or animal manure. On the surface of such soil or in certain caves there will be a white crust on the surface of the soil. The important feature of this soil is that it should contain organic material which contains nitrogen: chiefly proteins and their decomposition product, urea. Bacteria in the soil oxidize these nitrogen compounds to a family of nitrate salts: sodium nitrate, potassium nitrate, and calcium nitrate, depending on the other minerals present in the soil. These nitrate compounds are among the most soluble of all compounds. The solubilities of sodium, calcium, and potassium nitrate in boiling water are 952, 376, and 247 g / 100 mL. That is, boiling water will dissolve more than nine times its own weight of sodium nitrate.
The process for making saltpeter is very similar to that for making potash, the chief difference being the starting material. The soluble part of wood ash is mostly potassium carbonate and so when we purify it by recrystalization, the resulting product is purified potassium carbonate. The soluble part of these manurial soils are mostly mixed nitrates. The reason for this is that while the original animal waste may have had a wide variety of soluble materials, as the water wicked up through the soil and evaporated, the less soluble parts fell out of solution as it became more and more concentrated. Only the most soluble parts, in this case the nitrates, made it to the top of the soil and when the last bit of moisture evaporated, they were deposited as a white crust on the surface.
So the beginning of primitive saltpeter production is to collect this white crust leaving behind as much as possible the underlying soil. Of the three nitrates present, potassium nitrate is the one we need. To extract it, we use a metathesis reaction in much the same way that we have previously produced lye:
Ca(NO3)2(aq) + K2CO3(aq) -----> CaCO3(s) + 2 KNO3(aq)
This removes all the calcium as insoluble calcium carbonate leaving mostly potassium nitrate and a little sodium and potassium carbonate which can be further separated out by repeated recrystalizations in much the same way that we produced potash.
Saltpeter has been mined in Virginia, particularly in the dry caves of the Shenendoah valley. Most of the nitrate mined today comes from Chile and is called "Chile Saltpeter," which is chiefly sodium nitrate. However, most of the nitrate used in explosives and agriculture is today derived from nitrogen in the air


I trust you found this interesting, to say the least.

Quote from “this old Caveman Chemistry website”
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Unread postAuthor: Killjoy » Wed Feb 07, 2007 8:11 pm

Play with dog sh*t or pay 5 bucks for a pound of potassium nitrate from a chemcial supplier....hmm hard choice lol.
Actually that information was "interesting", I would have really hated to have been a pyro 300 years ago.
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Unread postAuthor: Deko » Thu Feb 08, 2007 6:39 pm

judgment_arms wrote:Hehehe, saltpeter, I can tell you how to make it from stuff found around your house, especially if you have pets…
You ever wondered were people got it 300 hundred years ago, In bat caves! (not the bat cave, but bat caves, as were bats live.) It’s made from dung, crap, poop, what ever you want to call it. I’m to lazy to type it when I can copy it…
Saltpeter, or niter, is the common name for potassium nitrate. Biringuccio tels us how to extract it in his Pirotechnia:
As I told you in the chapter on salts, saltpeter is a mixture composed of many substances extracted with fire and water from arid and manurial soils, from that growth which exudes from new walls or from that loosened soil that is found in tombs or uninhabited caves where the rain cannot enter. It is my belief that it is engendered in these soils from an airy moisture that is drunk in and absorbed by the earthy dryness...
Biringuccio goes on to desrcibe a process for extracting saltpeter from this "manurial soil," i.e. soil that has formed from human or animal manure. On the surface of such soil or in certain caves there will be a white crust on the surface of the soil. The important feature of this soil is that it should contain organic material which contains nitrogen: chiefly proteins and their decomposition product, urea. Bacteria in the soil oxidize these nitrogen compounds to a family of nitrate salts: sodium nitrate, potassium nitrate, and calcium nitrate, depending on the other minerals present in the soil. These nitrate compounds are among the most soluble of all compounds. The solubilities of sodium, calcium, and potassium nitrate in boiling water are 952, 376, and 247 g / 100 mL. That is, boiling water will dissolve more than nine times its own weight of sodium nitrate.
The process for making saltpeter is very similar to that for making potash, the chief difference being the starting material. The soluble part of wood ash is mostly potassium carbonate and so when we purify it by recrystalization, the resulting product is purified potassium carbonate. The soluble part of these manurial soils are mostly mixed nitrates. The reason for this is that while the original animal waste may have had a wide variety of soluble materials, as the water wicked up through the soil and evaporated, the less soluble parts fell out of solution as it became more and more concentrated. Only the most soluble parts, in this case the nitrates, made it to the top of the soil and when the last bit of moisture evaporated, they were deposited as a white crust on the surface.
So the beginning of primitive saltpeter production is to collect this white crust leaving behind as much as possible the underlying soil. Of the three nitrates present, potassium nitrate is the one we need. To extract it, we use a metathesis reaction in much the same way that we have previously produced lye:
Ca(NO3)2(aq) + K2CO3(aq) -----> CaCO3(s) + 2 KNO3(aq)
This removes all the calcium as insoluble calcium carbonate leaving mostly potassium nitrate and a little sodium and potassium carbonate which can be further separated out by repeated recrystalizations in much the same way that we produced potash.
Saltpeter has been mined in Virginia, particularly in the dry caves of the Shenendoah valley. Most of the nitrate mined today comes from Chile and is called "Chile Saltpeter," which is chiefly sodium nitrate. However, most of the nitrate used in explosives and agriculture is today derived from nitrogen in the air


I trust you found this interesting, to say the least.

Quote from “this old Caveman Chemistry website”


interesting.... but i think ill jsut stick with buying it lol
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Unread postAuthor: singularity » Thu Feb 08, 2007 7:10 pm

kno3 is legal bought 11lbs of it off ebay last year, and stashed it at my friends house, bad decision on my part. he tried to make a massive smoke bomb out of it and got 2nd degree burns, now his mom has stashed it somewhere. i would go looking for it but i have a feeling he would be like wtf you doing here
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