Login    Register
User Information
Username:
Password:
We are a free and open
community, all are welcome.
Click here to Register
Sponsored
Who is online

In total there are 66 users online :: 4 registered, 0 hidden and 62 guests


Most users ever online was 155 on Mon Aug 15, 2016 1:40 am

Registered users: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], MSNbot Media, Yahoo [Bot] based on users active over the past 5 minutes

The Team
Administrators
Global Moderators
global_moderators.png CS

electronic piston valves

Post questions and info about pneumatic (compressed gas) powered cannons here. This includes discussion about valves, pipe types, compressors, alternate gas setups, and anything else relevant.
Sponsored 
  • Author
    Message

electronic piston valves

Unread postAuthor: us sniper » Sun Mar 30, 2008 7:30 pm

has anyone on this site ever tried to build a homemade piston valve that was triggered electronically. I just looked at how solenoids are triggered and it seems pretty easy with an bumper hooked up to an electromagnet. This is what I am thinking, but I think the electronics could be improved to increase the charge delivered to the electromagnet.

http://s153.photobucket.com/albums/s240 ... t=new1.jpg
  • 0


us sniper
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 176
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:28 am
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: pizlo » Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:13 pm

Why, pneumatic actuation is faster?
  • 0

User avatar
pizlo
Brigadier General
Brigadier General
 
Posts: 783
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2006 7:27 pm
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: us sniper » Sun Mar 30, 2008 9:29 pm

I like the trigger system where is is mor realistic and hopefully this way it could look more like the commercial guns. I also want this to work because I am trying to build something that looks like either the daystate rifle that JSR has or the new daystate hunter.
  • 0


us sniper
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 176
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:28 am
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: MaxuS the 2nd » Sun Mar 30, 2008 9:31 pm

I don't really see any improvement over pneumatic actuation of the piston valve. The electromagnetic would have to be fairly strong in order to pull back a piston faster than it can be piloted normally. It's like reinventing the wheel. But go for it anyway and tell us how it worked out.
  • 0

User avatar
MaxuS the 2nd
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 674
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2008 3:59 pm
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: judgment_arms » Mon Mar 31, 2008 9:40 pm

Sorry friend, it’s not going to work to as you drew it; the air will just push the piston back.
You’re going to have to use the electromagnet to hold the piston shut; in which case, if the electromagnet failed the gun would go off prematurely, possibly resulting in damage to person, place, or thing.

No, I think the answer to your problem is the use of a sear mechanism to hold the piston shut, it would be much more reliable, more compact, and wouldn’t require a battery.
That’s my two cents ($0.02u.s.).
  • 0

Call me "Judge", it's easier to type.

Spud gun safety rules
User avatar
judgment_arms
Major General
Major General
 
Posts: 1272
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 8:49 pm
Location: Not so beautiful North Carolina, but at least it’s the U.S.A.!
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: clide » Tue Apr 01, 2008 12:03 am

I haven't seen an electromagnetic valve on a homemade gun, but there is a pneumatic pitching machine (Zooka I believe) that uses an electromagnetic valve. I've posted a link to the patent somewhere on this site, but I'm too lazy to look it up right now, you can probably find it by searching if you are interested.
  • 0

<a href="http://gbcannon.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://gbcannon.com/pics/misc/pixel.png" border="0"></a>latest update - debut of the cardapult

clide
Donating Member
Donating Member
 
Posts: 785
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2005 3:06 am
Location: Oklahoma, USA
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Tue Apr 01, 2008 4:07 am

us sniper wrote:I am trying to build something that looks like either the daystate rifle that JSR has or the new daystate hunter.


Have a look here - the Daystate works just like most PCPs, using a hammer valve, but instead of a spring loaded hammer there's a capacitor which discharges through a solenoid which strikes the valve, allowing enough air to escape to fire one shot.
  • 0

User avatar
jackssmirkingrevenge
Donating Member
Donating Member
 
Posts: 24225
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 11:28 pm
Country: Holy See (Vatican City State) (va)
Reputation: 66

Sponsored

Sponsor
 


Unread postAuthor: Hotwired » Tue Apr 01, 2008 7:41 am

It would be nice to have a simple electronic trigger that didn't care less about pressures but the only practical things we've known of are solenoid triggered diaphragm valves which tend to have a rather moderate pressure rating.

Of course if you're not planning on going above say 150-200psi they can be used to trigger a piston valve quite well and with a very light button trigger instead of a fairly large and/or stiff blowgun lever.
  • 0

User avatar
Hotwired
Lieutenant General
Lieutenant General
 
Posts: 2599
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 5:51 am
Location: UK
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: bugsingelyn » Tue Apr 01, 2008 6:14 pm

Has anybody ever used a solenoid to push (or pull?) the piston back? It seems simple, but I don't know how powerful solenoid's can get, and how much battery it would use.
I thought of this a while back, and had a solenoid from a sprinkler valve, but they aren't strong enough I don't think. I am now on a constant search for a stronger one.
  • 0


bugsingelyn
Private First Class
Private First Class
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Sun Sep 10, 2006 2:58 pm
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: THUNDERLORD » Tue Apr 01, 2008 6:35 pm

I saw a really cheaply made electric staple gun at home depot(like 40$ now). It probably uses a spring and some kind of solenoid.It would be easy to take apart. It got me thinking about attaching a piston like a spring piston type air gun has to the part that normally drives the staple.
  • 0


THUNDERLORD
Major General
Major General
 
Posts: 1264
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2008 1:42 pm
Reputation: 0

Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Wed Apr 02, 2008 1:00 am

THUNDERLORD wrote:It got me thinking about attaching a piston like a spring piston type air gun has to the part that normally drives the staple.


You'd get performance similar to an AEG, it's not really worth the bother.

Has anybody ever used a solenoid to push (or pull?) the piston back?


It's possible theoretically, but in practice even with small calibres the force required is considerable (for example with a 6mm barrel at 100 psi, you'd need almost 4.5 lbs of force to pop the piston open) and would require a substantial solenoid and battery setup.
  • 0

User avatar
jackssmirkingrevenge
Donating Member
Donating Member
 
Posts: 24225
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 11:28 pm
Country: Holy See (Vatican City State) (va)
Reputation: 66

Return to Pneumatic Cannon Discussion

Who is online

Registered users: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], MSNbot Media, Yahoo [Bot]

Reputation System ©'