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"No Country" Captive Bolt question

Post questions and info about pneumatic (compressed gas) powered cannons here. This includes discussion about valves, pipe types, compressors, alternate gas setups, and anything else relevant.
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"No Country" Captive Bolt question

Unread postAuthor: Lentamentalisk » Sat Nov 29, 2008 5:52 pm

Alright, I know that any true spudgunner has seen No Country For Old Men, if only to see a creepy dude with a pneumatic device, kicking ass.

What I was wondering is this: will the lock mechanism really pop out like it does in the movie? It seems somewhat far fetched that it would not be mounted sufficiently to hold it in, and then what is to keep someone from taking a hammer to you lock?

Also, I am fairly familiar with the design concept, but if any of you have more detailed diagrams, that would be much appreciated.

[note] I am well aware of the previous discussions on captive bolt launchers here, but I don't recall an in depth discussion as to whether it is possible to remove the lock mechanism in such a way.
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Re: "No Country" Captive Bolt question

Unread postAuthor: THUNDERLORD » Sat Nov 29, 2008 6:55 pm

Lentamentalisk wrote:Alright, I know that any true spudgunner has seen No Country For Old Men, if only to see a creepy dude with a pneumatic device, kicking ass...


That Might be a true statement.
But at the time I was still drinking vodka, so when I snuck into the movie I fell asleep :D

Maybe there's a link to that scene on youtube(?),
but I don't have time to check right now. :(

Sounds cool though. 8)
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Re: "No Country" Captive Bolt question

Unread postAuthor: Ragnarok » Sat Nov 29, 2008 7:23 pm

Lentamentalisk wrote:It seems somewhat far fetched that it would not be mounted sufficiently to hold it in, and then what is to keep someone from taking a hammer to you lock?

You are perfectly correct. Captive bolt pistol or not, locks will not fall apart like that - indeed, a hammer would be a far more effective method.

But whoever said you had to go through the lock?
Much better ways to enter. My favourite starts about 2:00 into this video - you'll be honestly surprised how fast you can get through a door.
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Unread postAuthor: Lentamentalisk » Sat Nov 29, 2008 7:57 pm

Yes, but none of those are as easily concealable or as innocent looking as a little metal pipe and a CO2 canister...

What do you think of setting the captive bolt against the hinges?
I have also read of blowing freon into the lock mechanism to freeze it, and then go at it with a chisel and a hammer (fight club, thats right). Any verification of that method?

I am not trying to commit any great crime, I just like to know my options, should I need to be badass for some reason :wink:
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Unread postAuthor: Ragnarok » Sat Nov 29, 2008 8:23 pm

Lentamentalisk wrote:Yes, but none of those are as easily concealable or as innocent looking as a little metal pipe and a CO2 canister...

Who cares! Like you said: "Should I need to be badass for some reason"...
Taking the whole door off - or not using the door at all - has a badass quotient of about a thousand times that of just smashing the lock!!!

But don't use too much explosive, because you want to be avoiding collateral damage. Still cool though.

On the freezing the lock method, no, I highly doubt it.
Look, if you want to get through a door quickly, don't mess with the lock, it's slow, and overly complicated - try this instead.
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Unread postAuthor: THUNDERLORD » Sat Nov 29, 2008 9:51 pm

OK, I found it in this movie trailer http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBqmKSAHc6w
At :55.
It only shows few seconds of it though. :roll:

Perhaps a pneumatic grinder hooked to a regulator and a metal cutting saw blade with a bigger diameter blade than designed for,
or gear/pulley and also run at higher pressure
("badass"es don't need as much safety precautions because they're tougher than most anyway).
Then just cut the bolt in two. :roll: Something like this even: here(?)

Slightly less macho, but I've wondered if a large powerful electromagnet could spin the mechanism.
It would certainly lift a simple but heavy-duty metal bar type lock (turn the magnet on, move it, lifting the block, then turn it off).
But I've never tryed it. 8)
BTW, cool links Ragnarok !
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Unread postAuthor: Daltonultra » Sun Nov 30, 2008 1:05 am

The problem with the captive bolt gun is simple physics.

The door lock is a fixed object. Your hand isn't. If you place the thing right against he lock like he does in the movie, you're going to wind up with a jammed lock and a broken hand.
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Unread postAuthor: THUNDERLORD » Sun Nov 30, 2008 1:19 am

... If you place the thing right against he lock like he does in the movie, you're going to wind up with a jammed lock and a broken hand.


I disagree because I could put a 12 ga. w/ a slug against it and wind up with a broke lock and maybe a jammed hand but the lock would fly apart much faster and have a bigger hole in it. :roll: 8)

EDIT: Why didn't he just shoot the lock with the silenced 12 ga. thing i saw in the previews? :P :twisted: :roll: 8)
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Unread postAuthor: frankrede » Sun Nov 30, 2008 1:27 am

THUNDERLORD wrote:Slightly less macho, but I've wondered if a large powerful electromagnet could spin the mechanism.
It would certainly lift a simple but heavy-duty metal bar type lock (turn the magnet on, move it, lifting the block, then turn it off).
But I've never tryed it. 8)
BTW, cool links Ragnarok !

In the movie "Hollowman" they used that technique.


Or you can just take one of these to the door jam.
http://www.cessco.us/Partner/k950_16.html
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Unread postAuthor: Daltonultra » Sun Nov 30, 2008 1:42 am

frankrede wrote:Or you can just take one of these to the door jam.
http://www.cessco.us/Partner/k950_16.html


I believe you actually mean one of THESE.
The K950 is the industrial cut-off saw. The K12 is the fire and rescue all-duty saw. Wanna cut an armored car in half? Here's your dog.
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Unread postAuthor: THUNDERLORD » Sun Nov 30, 2008 12:05 pm

Daltonultra wrote:
frankrede wrote:Or you can just take one of these to the door jam.
http://www.cessco.us/Partner/k950_16.html


I believe you actually mean one of THESE....


Cool links Daltonultra and Frankrede. :wink:
It lists "forcible entry" as uses even on there. :twisted:
Looks like a glorified concrete saw for cutting sidewalk sections.
I've seen used ones in pawn shops for cheaper.

Yeah, with a hole in the lock, that doesn't mean the door would open immediately like the movie scene.
Which is why I suggested some sort of saw.

Lentamentalisk had stated
Yes, but none of those are as easily concealable or as innocent looking as a little metal pipe and a CO2 canister...

Which is why I suggested one of the many air motor powered tools connected to a pressure tank and regulator with a metal cutting blade attached.

BTW Although looking at the gasoline powered one, I remember seeing a 40cc(or 49cc?) chain saw in a sears for $140 yesterday. Upon closer inspection I noticed it has a centrifugal clutch between the shaft and chain!
Also for higher RPM I saw a performance timing chain with sprockets for $38 in an auto zone. A little heavy though. With the right blade and exhaust muffler I suppose it would run quiet and be nearly half the monster linked to! (still larger and heavier than the "captive bolt or an air motor saw though). 8)
EDIT: And far more overly complicated than the methods Rag linked to :P

EDIT2: Rag's link reminded me of a giant one of These connected to a powerful hydraulic jack for cutting bars etc.
Also the hydraulic jack tube assembly is a component that can withstand some high pressure applications...
(I've been working in a metal/ welding shop and everyday when I padlock my locker I think about how silly that is...) :wink:
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Last edited by THUNDERLORD on Sun Nov 30, 2008 12:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Unread postAuthor: Ragnarok » Sun Nov 30, 2008 12:29 pm

THUNDERLORD wrote:BTW, cool links Ragnarok !

Well, if you're entertained by the daftness of soldiers, you'd probably be amused by this one too.
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Unread postAuthor: THUNDERLORD » Sun Nov 30, 2008 12:48 pm

Ragnarok wrote: Well, if you're entertained by the daftness of soldiers, you'd probably be amused by this one too.


That vid should end with "Be all that you can be, In the Army!" :P
BTW,I was adding some edits to my last reply when that went through. 8)
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Mon Dec 01, 2008 12:44 pm

It basically works like any pneumatic nailgun - quick release valve that drives a piston.

Also, holding it to the door is irrelevant. For all intents and purposes, since the lock is closer to the edge of the bolt than the structure stopping its travel, it's like you fired a free-flight projectile.
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