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6mmm carbine *UPDATE5*

Post questions and info about pneumatic (compressed gas) powered cannons here. This includes discussion about valves, pipe types, compressors, alternate gas setups, and anything else relevant.
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Unread postAuthor: ramses » Tue Mar 02, 2010 4:51 pm

Nice! Hopefully that will get painted flat black, or metalic gold...
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Unread postAuthor: Demon » Tue Mar 02, 2010 5:25 pm

Nice! Hopefully that will get painted flat black, or metalic gold...


I actually tought of making the receiver green, just to show its a "toy" (The goal here is surely not to intimidate as its VERY close to the legal limit and i dont want to get the attention of bystanders ( Actually, i need to register it as it fires at 4.5 ft/lbs, when the legal limit is 4.2 :roll: )

Anyway, i will make a tiny compartement on the gun where i will place a few .2g bbs so that if ever it is took for a test at the police departement, the power will now be 3 ftlbs :D
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Unread postAuthor: POLAND_SPUD » Tue Mar 02, 2010 5:52 pm

@demon

just to show its a "toy"
wow that's a great idea... add a bit of pink plastic here and there and the cops will laugh when they see it... probably they wouldn't even bother to test if it's within the limit

damn that's clever

Acually, if i placed a 3 way valve on the trigger and a 12g co2 cartidge in the handle, i could had got a nice semi automatic pistol !

But i will stick to the carbine design ...
... but what stops you from building a semi auto carbine?? :D
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Unread postAuthor: Gippeto » Tue Mar 02, 2010 9:16 pm

Oh G'damn... he's picking on another 13year old!!


Demon, if you register a handgun over the 500fps limit and over the 4.2ftlb limit, it is a restricted weapon, and you'll need your RPAL, and you'll need to be 18 to get it.

In your shoes, I think I'd tone it down under 500fps, and leave it as a non-firearm.

Some other fun facts of life in Canukistan;

In addition to the requirement for an RPAL, restricted weapons in Canada may only be used (legally) on an approved firing range, you'll need a transit permit to carry it from your house to the range as well (don't get caught changing your route plan either), and don't forget safe storage (a biggy!).

All that for an airsoft gun shooting 520fps. :roll:

Keeping it under 500fps makes all these (not so) little problems disappear. :)

Complete it (good work BTW) and run it over a chrony...if it's over 500fps, make some adjustments to get it under. Doesn't have to be by much. :)
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Unread postAuthor: POLAND_SPUD » Tue Mar 02, 2010 9:55 pm

@gippetto
that's why I think it's so clever of him that he decided to use a green frame that makes it look more like a toy than something dangerous

In addition to the requirement for an RPAL, restricted weapons in Canada may only be used (legally) on an approved firing range, you'll need a transit permit to carry it from your house to the range as well (don't get caught changing your route plan either), and don't forget safe storage (a biggy!)
there are similar restrictions here too. The funniest thing is that you might get into quite a lot of problems if you register a gun.

In case someone or something gets shot with an airgun in your town you can expect the police to pay you a visit and you'd have to prove you had nothing to do with it...

I think I'd tone it down under 500fps, and leave it as a non-firearm
the thing that always wondered me is how they know what pressure he uses it at ??
ok in case of springers that's fairly simple but what about PCPs (or pneuamtic spudguns) or PCAs ?

I have a cheapo PCA airgun that can go above the limit of 17J if I pump it like 15 times... the only thing that's supposed to stop people from using higher pressures is the manual for it taht says 'the max number of times you can pump the gun is 5' or something like that

anyone can buy it yet there is nothing that stops anyone from going past 17J limit


now here is a similar question... what constitutes an air gun ? according to polish definition that's a thing that propels projectiles through the barrel using compressed air... well if you think of it even a sandblaster fits this definition

now the best part... imagine you're a cop and you find at someone house two lengths of iron pipe, a ball valve and a couple of fittings (all dissembled).... lol it might be damn hard to prove that he used them to build a spudgun
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Unread postAuthor: Gippeto » Tue Mar 02, 2010 10:39 pm

the thing that always wondered me is how they know what pressure he uses it at ??


They don't.

If he registers it, it'll be as a handgun, and thus...restricted, and every little detail will be "on file".

If he doesn't register it, and it never comes to their attention...

But if it DID come to their attention, and they got a warrant, checked it, and it was over 500fps, someone would be in deep trouble.

I'm being quite serious when I recommend he keep it under 500fps.

imagine you're a cop and you find at someone house two lengths of iron pipe, a ball valve and a couple of fittings


"Heck fire officer...them's just plumb'in supplies! Aaaayyupp!"
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Unread postAuthor: POLAND_SPUD » Tue Mar 02, 2010 11:37 pm

@gippeto
have you registered your high pressure coax gun ? :D

keep it under 500fps
the problem here is that theoretically speaking they have no idea what ammo he used...
what if they say 'we knew you used 0.8g steel bbs :twisted: '

now try to prove that was not the case

if that worked you could claim that a 0.5" calibre gun running on unregged CO2 is perfectly legal because you used marshmellows as ammo

do you think they'd take your word for it ??

the fact that he used that green frame is probably the best and the only thing that can help him to stay out of troubles... keeping that gun under 500 FPS will make it less fun and might not help at all
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Unread postAuthor: Gippeto » Wed Mar 03, 2010 12:49 am

do you think they'd take your word for it ??


I think it's best not to find out.

As to the co-ax, there is currently an amnesty for non restricted long guns. :)

There is a bill in the works to actually kill the registration requirement for non restricted long guns. If it passes in time, or they extend the amnesty again, the co-ax never will be registered. All I'll need is a valid PAL, which I have.
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Unread postAuthor: Demon » Wed Mar 03, 2010 9:35 am

keep it under 500fps
the problem here is that theoretically speaking they have no idea what ammo he used...
what if they say 'we knew you used 0.8g steel bbs '

now try to prove that was not the case


:twisted: Thats what i said, i will keep a bag of .2 g bb's, wich will give 600 fps and only 3 ft/lb

.88g bbs give like 450 fps and 5.2 ft/lbs.

SO, it is impossible that it goes over both the ft/lbs limit and fps limit if i dont use the .43 g bb (530 fps and 4.2 gt/lbs)



Just for the sake of safety, shoud i put a pop-off valve to limit to 5 pumps? Or else, i would be getting 8 ft/lbs if i pump 10 times ...
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Unread postAuthor: Gippeto » Wed Mar 03, 2010 9:57 am

Demon, if it will not exceed BOTH limits, there is no requirement to register it.

:)
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Unread postAuthor: Demon » Wed Mar 03, 2010 12:36 pm

Demon, if it will not exceed BOTH limits, there is no requirement to register it.


It will if i pump 10 times, unless i use 3 gram steel projectiles with a very sharp end ... :roll:
The law is strange ...

EDIT:

I have started to make the trigger mech, hopefully posting pictures today.
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Unread postAuthor: Gippeto » Wed Mar 03, 2010 12:51 pm

Then install a relief valve as you mentioned, or otherwise "de tune" it.(ie. shorten the barrel, add a restriction to the system (reduce the porting diameter), etc.)

The law doesn't always make sense to "the little guy", and there's no explanation I can give you for it. It just "is".
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Unread postAuthor: POLAND_SPUD » Wed Mar 03, 2010 2:56 pm

The law doesn't always make sense to "the little guy"
or just say it doesn't make sense at all... :D


personally I asked myself the same questions as you did and I concluded that if they find out what I do it wouldn't matter much if I have a gun that has ME of 15 J (below the limit here) or 100J...
not that I encourage you to do the same... it's up to you
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Unread postAuthor: ramses » Wed Mar 03, 2010 7:56 pm

POLAND_SPUD wrote:In case someone or something gets shot with an airgun in your town you can expect the police to pay you a visit and you'd have to prove you had nothing to do with it...


Guilty until proven innocent... God I keep hating Europe more and more...

I suppose the paint is up to you

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Unread postAuthor: Demon » Thu Mar 04, 2010 1:18 pm

UPDATE 4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIWV7UhmoaI

Here is the trigger

Its far from being complete but at least i can see the idea works ...
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