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Paintball Machine Gun, A Few Questions

Post questions and info about pneumatic (compressed gas) powered cannons here. This includes discussion about valves, pipe types, compressors, alternate gas setups, and anything else relevant.
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Unread postAuthor: Gun Freak » Thu Jul 08, 2010 9:31 am

jackssmirkingrevenge wrote:
ramses wrote:I will fill in for Poland spud and suggest a 3 way valve as the pilot. Or a 4 way, which would allow you to fill from the chamber.


With a 3 way, the air feed is blocked off when the pilot is opened so no need for chamber filling. Hooking up the pilot side to a pop-off should technically allow you to retain the full-auto function.


The three way was what I was thinking about last night for this design, but I never got around to posting it. Oh well...

Anyway, a three way could only be used for semi auto (me likey semi auto) because once it is vented, the air input line is blocked, therefor disabling the gun to fill again. The shooter would have to let go of the button to let it fill again, therefor it can only be semi auto.

Yeah yeah yeah, I build a couple guns a month sometimes but they are usually cheap but this a bigger and harder build so I'll spend a while planning it and I'd use a 3 way but there expensive and I've never really under stood them. Also do they work like piston valves or diaphram valves, and they are triggered electronically arent they.


You can get cheap three ways, or build one for about 5 bucks, or use the Blowgun Three Way, if that doesn't have enough flow then you can hook it up to a cascading piston valve design, three ways are not hard to understand at all. They are not like piston or phragm valves. Here is my design for a homemade one in 1/2" pvc...
Green inlet, blue pilot, red exhaust. Pull back on the bolt to vent the pilot. Three way valves basically control the flow path of the air. They are also called directional control valves.
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Unread postAuthor: clemsonguy1125 » Thu Jul 08, 2010 10:23 am

In your design gun freak wouldn't the pilot be open the whole time?
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Thu Jul 08, 2010 11:56 am

Gun Freak wrote:Anyway, a three way could only be used for semi auto (me likey semi auto) because once it is vented, the air input line is blocked, therefor disabling the gun to fill again. The shooter would have to let go of the button to let it fill again, therefor it can only be semi auto.


Fair point, that'll teach me to articulate pneumatic pathway assertions while I'm supposed to be working ;)
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Unread postAuthor: POLAND_SPUD » Thu Jul 08, 2010 12:04 pm

@JSR
well... you can achieve full auto with the use of DCV valves
:wink:
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Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Thu Jul 08, 2010 12:28 pm

POLAND_SPUD wrote:well... you can achieve full auto with the use of DCV valves
:wink:


So much for there being sophistication in simplicity :roll: :D
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Unread postAuthor: Gun Freak » Thu Jul 08, 2010 4:32 pm

clemsonguy1125 wrote:In your design gun freak wouldn't the pilot be open the whole time?

No, the pilot is open to the inlet the whole time but only open to exhaust once you push the button, and once you push it the inlet is also blocked off so it can pilot faster.
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Unread postAuthor: clemsonguy1125 » Thu Jul 08, 2010 4:45 pm

Oh ok, this gun is getting more aand more confusing, if i build it, im building JSRs sketch, and is there a seperate pilot valve, such as a blowgun
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Unread postAuthor: POLAND_SPUD » Thu Jul 08, 2010 4:54 pm

naah it isn't confusing... what I posted above is just a self switching version of a typical 3 way + QEV combo

the 3 way + QEV + air cylinder is probably the simplest way to build a working semi...
well I don't think I even recall anyone who tried to build a gun using that design and he failed but there have been quite a few failed BFB



@jsr
So much for there being sophistication in simplicity
now I get it...

let me quote Antoine de Saint-Exupery
In anything at all, perfection is finally attained not when there is no longer anything to add, but when there is no longer anything to take away.

sure there are some things you can take away from the QEV + 3 way + air cylinder combo...
the air cylinder is not 100% required and you can just use a simple T
instead
you can get rid of the QEV (but it is convenient because DCVs with large porting are relatively expensive)
but you can't take away the 3 way

you might think that the hammer valve or piston valve filled through chamebr side is simpler but that's delusive...

The design I posted above (fullauto circuit) is just a 3 way combo that switches itself as soon as pressure is present at port P... I'd say it is as simple as it gets...

sure the valveless design does seem a bit simpler but it is something completely different from this


Ahhh why did you mention 3 way valves !! I almost forgot about them...
now the voices in my head are saying 'valves.... valves....... valvessssss!! :x '
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Last edited by POLAND_SPUD on Thu Jul 08, 2010 5:15 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Unread postAuthor: clemsonguy1125 » Thu Jul 08, 2010 4:59 pm

But what I dont get is why is a three way nessacery, why not just use a blowgun
Edit-Mines still gonna be a full auto, I could use a QEV Pop-off combo, but it would still have a BFB
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Unread postAuthor: Gun Freak » Thu Jul 08, 2010 5:43 pm

The three way would only be necessary if you were to fill from the pilot side to prevent honking.
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Unread postAuthor: clemsonguy1125 » Thu Jul 08, 2010 5:53 pm

It wont honk if i fill it quickly, and also, does honking just annoy you or does it reduce performance
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Unread postAuthor: Gun Freak » Thu Jul 08, 2010 7:16 pm

Just annoys me I don't think it makes the gun perform any different, I find it kind of funny actually so I don't care about the honking. On my first piston gun, also my first gun that used a sprinkler valve, it honked on the first fill and I was like "what the hell?" lol I have a video of my first shot. It sucked, put a AA about 50 fps lmao
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Unread postAuthor: clemsonguy1125 » Thu Jul 08, 2010 7:19 pm

wow i didnt take videos till my machine guns and piston valves, this guns defianatly going full auto
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Unread postAuthor: Gun Freak » Thu Jul 08, 2010 7:31 pm

Its uploading, hang on a minute, I'll post it here.
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Unread postAuthor: clemsonguy1125 » Thu Jul 08, 2010 7:35 pm

Was that your first attempt at a Piston Valve, and that airsoft handle keeps popping in all your guns
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