Login    Register
User Information
Username:
Password:
We are a free and open
community, all are welcome.
Click here to Register
Sponsored
Who is online

In total there are 36 users online :: 6 registered, 0 hidden and 30 guests


Most users ever online was 218 on Wed Dec 07, 2016 6:58 pm

Registered users: Bing [Bot], Exabot [Bot], Google [Bot], Majestic-12 [Bot], MSNbot Media, Yahoo [Bot] based on users active over the past 5 minutes

The Team
Administrators
Global Moderators
global_moderators.png CS

Something I was thinking about

Post questions and info about pneumatic (compressed gas) powered cannons here. This includes discussion about valves, pipe types, compressors, alternate gas setups, and anything else relevant.
Sponsored 
  • Author
    Message

Something I was thinking about

Unread postAuthor: Jack_Hogg » Sun Oct 13, 2013 4:31 pm

Hi there,

Its been a while since I've been on here, but there are always those periods I am thinking about a idea. I was wondering if there is a posibility to make a recoilless hi-power arrow gun. The idea came from the stakegun in the game "Painkiller".

In order to manage this, I have thought of this:
Image

The arrow plus all of its moving components ontop of the gun should be the same weight as on the other side of the cable, wich is the piston ram, and its parts. Low as possible friction for the moving parts, and the piston fired by QEV en pilotted by a 2/3 way-valve for high preformance. The acceleration of the arrow and the piston are equal, yet bi-directional. Therefor the forces work against eachother wich result is a rifle that can shoot quite heavy arrows with almost no recoil.

What do you think?
  • 0

40BAR
Proud member of the Dutch Spud Clan!
User avatar
Jack_Hogg
Sergeant First Class
Sergeant First Class
 
Posts: 133
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 7:56 am
Reputation: 0

Re: Something I was thinking about

Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Sun Oct 13, 2013 8:02 pm

Look who's still lurking :)

Not going to get much performance with all that crap the air has to push.

A simple disk sabot will do:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMbW0RdnZEU[/youtube]

If you're worried about recoil, countermass, armbrust style :)

Image
  • 0

User avatar
jackssmirkingrevenge
Donating Member
Donating Member
 
Posts: 24225
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 11:28 pm
Country: Holy See (Vatican City State) (va)
Reputation: 66

Re: Something I was thinking about

Unread postAuthor: Technician1002 » Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:36 am

The original plan fails when you try to stop the counter mass. Works if it keeps going, but not if it comes to a stop.
  • 0

User avatar
Technician1002
Chief of Staff
Chief of Staff
 
Posts: 5190
Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2009 11:10 am
Reputation: 14

Re: Something I was thinking about

Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Mon Oct 14, 2013 9:07 am

Have a look at the work of your fellow Dutchman: pneumatic-cannon-database/topic19729.html
  • 0

User avatar
jackssmirkingrevenge
Donating Member
Donating Member
 
Posts: 24225
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 11:28 pm
Country: Holy See (Vatican City State) (va)
Reputation: 66

Re: Something I was thinking about

Unread postAuthor: wyz2285 » Tue Oct 15, 2013 3:45 pm

He is talking about recoilless, not noiseless.
Instead of all that trouble, why not just a gas ram pushing the arrow?
  • 0

CpTn_lAw wrote::D "yay, me wanna make big multishot pnoob with 1000 psi foot pump compressor using diamond as main material. Do you think wet bread make good sealant? " :D
User avatar
wyz2285
Major General
Major General
 
Posts: 2244
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 7:50 am
Location: Porto, Portugal
Country: Portugal (pt)
Reputation: 12

Re: Something I was thinking about

Unread postAuthor: Talk » Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:12 pm

Maybe you can do this to remove some of the extra stuff you used there :)
  • 0

Attachments
Arrow-crop.JPG
Arrow-crop.JPG (5.45 KiB) Viewed 464 times
User avatar
Talk
Staff Sergeant
Staff Sergeant
 
Posts: 105
Joined: Tue Sep 24, 2013 2:47 pm
Country: Maldives (mv)
Reputation: 1

Re: Something I was thinking about

Unread postAuthor: dart guy » Tue Oct 15, 2013 8:13 pm

It seem talk has a point, I would just make a stock with a rubber buttpad made of about 3 layers .
  • 0

when life gives you lemons... make root beer and leave the world wondering how you did that :D
User avatar
dart guy
Major
Major
 
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon May 13, 2013 7:54 pm
Location: not telling you
Reputation: 5

Re: Something I was thinking about

Sponsored

Sponsor
 


Re: Something I was thinking about

Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Tue Oct 15, 2013 8:51 pm

wyz2285 wrote:He is talking about recoilless, not noiseless.


That it is noiseless is serendipitous, regardless it is a good way to launch a rod like projectile. Also, not releasing the propelling gasses cuts down on recoil... in fact you could duct them to flow towards the rear of the launcher to counteract recoil :)

Instead of all that trouble, why not just a gas ram pushing the arrow?


Pretty much how pneumatic spearguns work.
  • 0

User avatar
jackssmirkingrevenge
Donating Member
Donating Member
 
Posts: 24225
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 11:28 pm
Country: Holy See (Vatican City State) (va)
Reputation: 66

Re: Something I was thinking about

Unread postAuthor: wyz2285 » Wed Oct 16, 2013 2:43 am

Arrows have some considerable mass, the exhaust gas is insignificant to cause recoil. Dry fire my 3/4 piston with 500 psi cause much less recoil than launch a standard bow arrow with 3/8 port QEV with 200 psi and less chamber volume.
  • 0

CpTn_lAw wrote::D "yay, me wanna make big multishot pnoob with 1000 psi foot pump compressor using diamond as main material. Do you think wet bread make good sealant? " :D
User avatar
wyz2285
Major General
Major General
 
Posts: 2244
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 7:50 am
Location: Porto, Portugal
Country: Portugal (pt)
Reputation: 12

Re: Something I was thinking about

Unread postAuthor: jackssmirkingrevenge » Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:44 am

wyz2285 wrote:Arrows have some considerable mass, the exhaust gas is insignificant to cause recoil. Dry fire my 3/4 piston with 500 psi cause much less recoil than launch a standard bow arrow with 3/8 port QEV with 200 psi and less chamber volume.


Let's say you have 500mL at 500 psi, that's about 20 grams of air... thats about what a typical .454 Casull bullet weighs, not an inconsiderable amount. Turn that around to face the shooter and you have something much more effective than a muzzle brake because all the air comes out in the opposite direction of the projectile travel.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQc7x8eY5Aw[/youtube]

Having seen the launcher Jack wants to replicate, I can see where he's coming from.
  • 0

User avatar
jackssmirkingrevenge
Donating Member
Donating Member
 
Posts: 24225
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 11:28 pm
Country: Holy See (Vatican City State) (va)
Reputation: 66

Re: Something I was thinking about

Unread postAuthor: wyz2285 » Wed Oct 16, 2013 5:36 am

Forgot to mention, the 3/4 piston it's a lot heavier than the 3/8, so I can't argue much :)
  • 0

CpTn_lAw wrote::D "yay, me wanna make big multishot pnoob with 1000 psi foot pump compressor using diamond as main material. Do you think wet bread make good sealant? " :D
User avatar
wyz2285
Major General
Major General
 
Posts: 2244
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 7:50 am
Location: Porto, Portugal
Country: Portugal (pt)
Reputation: 12

Re: Something I was thinking about

Unread postAuthor: Brian the brain » Wed Nov 06, 2013 1:32 pm

With a captive piston and an arrow i doublt you'll have the "recoil" you've had with your 40 bar launcher and a solid lead slug...


Because on top of the actual recoil ( gun pushes projectile and vice versa) you also feel propulsion.The jet of air pushing out of the barrel acts like a rocket engine pushing out exhaust gasses.
This will not be felt if air doesn't leave the barrel.
Furthermore: the captive piston hits the stopper at the end of the barrel, jerking the launcher forward a bit.

If things are still to rough for you, you could fill a tank connected to your exhaustvalve with water ( and sand to give it more weight) and have it eject it's contents in the opposite direction...

It'll be like a bottlerocket pushing against the recoil.
  • 1

Gun Freak wrote:
Oh my friggin god stop being so awesome, that thing is pure kick ass. Most innovative and creative pneumatic that the files have ever come by!

Can't ask for a better compliment!!
User avatar
Brian the brain
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 3494
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2005 2:06 am
Location: Holland
Country: Netherlands (nl)
Reputation: 29

Return to Pneumatic Cannon Discussion

Who is online

Registered users: Bing [Bot], Exabot [Bot], Google [Bot], Majestic-12 [Bot], MSNbot Media, Yahoo [Bot]

Reputation System ©'