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A place to ask general spud cannon related questions.
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Unread postAuthor: D_Hall » Mon Jun 23, 2008 11:00 pm

daxspudder wrote:The boundary of low power to high power is with the "J" type rocket which requires a license sponsored by the FAA to fire in the continental US.

Uh... No. The license required (as previously mentioned) is the LEUP and it's issued by the ATF. The FAA comes into it only because you need to file a NOTAMS before you launch.

Actual licensing from the FAA isn't required until you start talking about exoatmospheric.

L or M can put a small rocket into sub orbit, so the restriction is due to the risk of horizontal launching
Putting an M into exo would be quite a trick. Granted, I've not run the numbers lately, but I'll even submit that "trick" = "impossible given current state of the art."
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Unread postAuthor: D_Hall » Mon Jun 23, 2008 11:02 pm

sandman wrote:a G is 160 Newtons i think (i shall check), and every letter doubles

Edit: i r right, it is 160


Not Newtons.... Newton Seconds. HUGE difference. One is a measure of force, the other a measure of impulse.

C = <=5 N*s
D = <=10 N*s
E = <=20 N*s
F = <=40 N*s
G = <=80 N*s
H = <=160 N*s
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Unread postAuthor: daxspudder » Mon Jun 23, 2008 11:52 pm

wow, d_hall hate... I thought I did mention it has been a few years, and even then I wasnt that big on it, I was just throwing something close to it out there... but yeah.... guess I could have just looked it up on the internet and have given better data, but I guess I didnt care that much, but thanks for correcting my laziness... even though it did keep the thread alive long enough for you to notice it and post the right answer... if you get where im going...
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Unread postAuthor: D_Hall » Tue Jun 24, 2008 1:26 am

Not hate, just a topic that I know very well. This one falls squarely into the realm of how I make my living.
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Unread postAuthor: D_Hall » Tue Jun 24, 2008 9:15 am

DYI wrote:I live too far away from the areas of strict enforcement to really care.
I suspect that's the biggest factor right there.

Like many things, I believe that getting the license to do it can be a lot more trouble (and in some cases, more risky)
All they do is deny you your license and tell you why (so that you can correct it; it's not generally a lifetime ban or anything).

If I lived in the US, where you can easily be thrown in prison for what is essentially the rest of your life for doing something completely harmless to anyone but yourself, my views would probably be different.

What is Canada's take on you taking up target shooting pistols?

Whatever happened to "live and let live"...

It was never more than a fairy tale.
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Unread postAuthor: sandman » Tue Jun 24, 2008 11:51 am

D_Hall wrote: Putting an M into exo would be quite a trick. Granted, I've not run the numbers lately, but I'll even submit that "trick" = "impossible given current state of the art."
i think someone put a N into space, but i dont remember his name, or if was a N motor that did it

and ya its not tough to get the license, lvl 1 is really easy, all u have to do is successfully launch a rocket using a motor in that class, lvl 2 you have to do what u did for lvl 1 and complete a test which has some of the questions and answers on the NAR web site, and lvl 3 u you have to do what u did for lvl 2, and provide pictorial proof that you are the one building the rocket and be able to answer various questions about the rocket.
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Unread postAuthor: DYI » Tue Jun 24, 2008 2:02 pm

What is Canada's take on you taking up target shooting pistols?


Like most of these things, Canada probably wouldn't like it very much. That's one of the flaws here, the strict firearm laws. But, once again, location helps me quite a bit.

It was never more than a fairy tale.


Probably, but it hasn't always been so far from reality as it is now.
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Unread postAuthor: D_Hall » Tue Jun 24, 2008 2:14 pm

sandman wrote:and ya its not tough to get the license, lvl 1 is really easy, all u have to do is successfully launch a rocket using a motor in that class, lvl 2 you have to do what u did for lvl 1 and complete a test which has some of the questions and answers on the NAR web site, and lvl 3 u you have to do what u did for lvl 2, and provide pictorial proof that you are the one building the rocket and be able to answer various questions about the rocket.

Tripoli's Level 1-3 certifications have nothing to do with the ATF's requirements for a LEUP. Nor does it *legally* have anything to do with you purchasing HPR motors. You absolutely CAN buy them (from a legal perspective) sans any Tripoli certifications if you have your LEUP.

Historically, getting a LEUP *was* a big deal. For starters, it required that you own a magazine that was stored (IIRC) 100' from any inhabited building. That right there eliminated anybody who lived in a city; rural folks only!

However, in recent years they've made an odd deal... You can get a LEUP sans magazine *provided* that somebody who DOES have a magazine (and a LEUP) signs on the dotted line that they'll store the motors for you. For HPR purposes, this means that dealers are often willing to "co-sign" for your LEUP.

All that said.... While it may be legal to buy HPR motors with just a LEUP, most dealers aren't up on all the laws (crazy, I know!) and simply will not sell to anyone who doesn't have a Tripoli certification (even though it's totally legal).
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Last edited by D_Hall on Tue Jun 24, 2008 2:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Unread postAuthor: sandman » Tue Jun 24, 2008 2:15 pm

DYI i feel that you should know that your signature is Win

and that i know friends go shooting in their backyards if they are outside town, so i guess im in the same boat as you, but rockets are much different, because if it lands on someone truck going down the highway someone going to notice, unlike if they heard a gunshot its not like they know who fired it

Edit: i thought that higher level magazines allowed you to store them in inhabited areas?
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Unread postAuthor: POLAND_SPUD » Tue Jun 24, 2008 2:32 pm

sandman it depends what you build.... I got 10 m of 1.5" steel pipe lying around and a 1.5" union.... while it's going to be fun to make a pneumatic from these and fire it.. I suppose that it's going to be rather easy to notice (or hear) :D

besides don't complain :wink: - in most countries in the world you can't enter a shop and buy a gun...
what is more 90% of people in poland have never fired a firearm even once in their entire life... now compare that to the USA
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Unread postAuthor: D_Hall » Tue Jun 24, 2008 5:03 pm

sandman wrote:Edit: i thought that higher level magazines allowed you to store them in inhabited areas?

You may be right on that one, but given how expensive the low level mags are, I'm pretty sure my wallet would scream if I even looked sideways at the upper end stuff.
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Unread postAuthor: sandman » Tue Jun 24, 2008 6:06 pm

actually rocketry is the reason i came to spudgunning, i couldnt keep going with the cost but i think after i finish my adv. combustion im going back to rocketry
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