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Difference between PVC Primer and PVC Cleaner?

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Difference between PVC Primer and PVC Cleaner?

Unread postAuthor: Coodude26 » Tue Jul 08, 2008 4:45 pm

I suspect there is some difference, but I can't tell what. what are the uses of the Cleaner? Is it cleaner->primer->cement?
Thanks.
PS I know there is a solvent welding class but I am 14 and unable to take it ( I suspect)
Thanks again.
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Unread postAuthor: SpudFarm » Tue Jul 08, 2008 4:51 pm

i only knew of primer and cement..

it may have nothing to do with gluing
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Unread postAuthor: rp181 » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:00 pm

cleaner is the can with the yellow lable, it does exactly what it says, it cleans, making solvent welding more effective.
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Unread postAuthor: psycix » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:05 pm

Cleaner could indeed be done before solvent welding to improve the weld.

But I will also have to tell you that I once rode that cleaner was the same as primer (may depend on brand or whatever, maybe some cleaners are just cleaners, and others are basically more like primers)
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Unread postAuthor: MrCrowley » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:05 pm

Cleaner....cleans the pipe. Don't confuse it with primer because cleaner is not a alternative to primer when solvent welding PVC.

You really only ever need to use primer and the cement, you can clean the pipe yourself well enough before bonding the pipe.
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Unread postAuthor: Coodude26 » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:08 pm

Makes sense...I just don't get why it's chemicals and not soapy water :)

2 last questions:
So, it should go cleaner->dry->primer->dry->cement?
And is the company "Oatey" or "Datey"?
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Unread postAuthor: MrCrowley » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:19 pm

It should go cleaner>dry>primer>cement.

Don't let the primer dry.

It really explains it all on the back of the container. I'm not 100% about the cleaner though.

The proper way is to primer the fitting, then primer the pipe you are gluing it to, then cement the fitting, then cement the pipe, then push together while twisting them 90 degrees, and hold for 30 seconds.

That should take about 1min 30seconds including the holding time. Don't let the primer or glue dry out.

Edit: I think it's Oatey, but it really doesn't matter, there are loads of brands. just try and use the same brand for both primer and cement.
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Unread postAuthor: starman » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:26 pm

MrCrowley wrote:Cleaner....cleans the pipe. Don't confuse it with primer because cleaner is not a alternative to primer when solvent welding PVC.


The Oatey cleaner here in the US is the exact same formulation as the Oatey Primer minus the purple dye.

Here's the primer ingredients...
Image

Here's the cleaner ingredients...
Image

The cleaner cleans and softens the PVC exactly the same way the purple primer stuff does...I use Oatey Cleaner exclusively to prime all my PVC joints. There's no need whatsoever to use the purple stuff on any spudgun project, where Oatey products are available anyway.

The purple dye is in the primer for building code plumbing sign off...basically the only way the inspectors can tell if the joints have been primed. County inspection isn't necessary on a spudgun project... :roll:

Trust me guys, I've done the homework on this. I would suggest a soap/water cleaning - Oatey Cleaner priming application - Heavy Duty Oatey cement, thickly applied.

Edit: I did a post regarding thisa few months back
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Last edited by starman on Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:47 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Unread postAuthor: MrCrowley » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:28 pm

I'm just going off what Jimmy101 said in reply to your post in the other topic.
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Unread postAuthor: starman » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:50 pm

MrCrowley wrote:I'm just going off what Jimmy101 said in reply to your post in the other topic.


I don't think I caught that response. Do you remember the subject in which we were discussing that?

Edit: That's OK I found with some search....and commented back to Jimmy here...
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Unread postAuthor: ralphd » Tue Jul 08, 2008 7:19 pm

What I was always told was that the two are the same thing only different. The purple is a visual aid in plumbing for inspectors.
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Unread postAuthor: clide » Tue Jul 08, 2008 8:34 pm

Same ingredients does not mean they are the same thing. As Jimmy's link in the other thread shows, the cleaner has different proportions, and Oatey's FAQ says primer and primer/cleaner are more aggressive than just cleaner.
http://www.oatey.com/Plumber/FAQ.html
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Unread postAuthor: starman » Tue Jul 08, 2008 8:46 pm

clide wrote:Same ingredients does not mean they are the same thing. As Jimmy's link in the other thread shows, the cleaner has different proportions, and Oatey's FAQ says primer and primer/cleaner are more aggressive than just cleaner.
http://www.oatey.com/Plumber/FAQ.html


I read it and understand it. I have found, and have enough corroborating evidence to say that Oatey Cleaner works equally as well for our purposes as does the purple stuff. I challenge you, like I did Jimmy, to try some joints for yourself.
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Unread postAuthor: clide » Tue Jul 08, 2008 9:10 pm

How do you propose I test it? Glue a joint and see if it fails? When I first started spudding I made several joints without any primer or cleaner and took them near the pressure rating of the pipe and they never failed. That doesn't mean it is a good idea. To properly test it you would need to test many different joints to failure and compare the results

What is the use of substituting cleaner for primer anyway? Easier to get in clear? Hardly seems worth it.
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Unread postAuthor: starman » Tue Jul 08, 2008 9:50 pm

clide wrote:How do you propose I test it? Glue a joint and see if it fails? When I first started spudding I made several joints without any primer or cleaner and took them near the pressure rating of the pipe and they never failed. That doesn't mean it is a good idea. To properly test it you would need to test many different joints to failure and compare the results

What is the use of substituting cleaner for primer anyway? Easier to get in clear? Hardly seems worth it.


I'm just asking you to try it on some joints...real cannon or scrap parts. Feel the softening action and how the cement responds. You've done a heck of a lot of PVC cementing yourself, you know what I'm talking about.

The purpose is no purple. Why deal with it if you don't have to? And it is worth it, to me at least, same strong bonds...why not? We are still talking about PVC cement here doing the actual glueing work...not a generational shift down to Elmer's wood glue or anything.

I'm not here to call anyone down for using the purple stuff. I understand a guy's desire to go by the book on this and I respect that. But this not unsafe or stupid advice and as far as I'm concerned at least, is a proven alternative.

Heck, I've even had small parts cement themselves together after just priming with cleaner...without cement... :shock: ... :wink: I obviously didn't use the parts in that condition but I did have to fit up and cement other replacement parts...they were permanently stuck together! That's how much the PVC is softened....IF you don't wait too long and let it dry of course.
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